34 replies to this topic

[Sebulon]

Hello,

I've been planning on building a highland setup for years now. Every time I am about to start doing something, I get a new "better" idea.

At first, I was thinking about doing it Martin Hingst style:
http://www.cpukforum...s...ic=28146

Then I found out what Tobias Kulig had done: :)
http://www.cpukforum...s...ic=35616

So, now I got this idea from Tobias's terra: turning a wine refrigerator into a small Highland setup. I found a wine refrigerator large enough to be a "terrarium" for 229€. It has all the fancy electronics within: it can be adjusted to 7-18 celsius (44-64 fahrenheit) and it has a screen that shows the temperature on the outside. It costs only a tad more than a water cooling system kit, plus the water cooling system requires the freezer anyway, so why not get straight to the refrigerator and use it as the terrarium.

Though there's a little problem with the wine refrigerator. How do I light it? If I stick the lights inside the cabinet, it will heat up. Otherwise I have to start doing some DIY action, and somehow rip the roof off from the system, and replace it with some plexiglass, like Tobias had done. It's just that I don't like the idea of destroying the thing, because Im such an amateur doing stuff like this.

Any ideas? Maybe I could somehow separate the lights inside the thing, and ventilate the hot air outside somehow?

Here's a link to a webshop, selling the doomsday machine Im so excited about:
http://www.markantal...sui-viinikaappi

Greetings,
Jarkko

[moof]

I must say I tought about a similar thing a year ago and almost bought it, but I decided to do the cooling like Martin Hingst did because I just couldn't find a way to install the light in a wine cooler like this one. The freezer method is ok for me but I really would like something more simple. I think that both replacing the "roof" with plexi or separating the light and getting the hot air outside needs some modifications to be done to the cooler. I think the first method would be better, the only thing is to figure out how to do it without harm to the cooler:) I hope we'll find a way to do it!

Peter

[RL7836]

Before spending that kind of money, you might want to consider buying a small refrigerator like they use in college dorms. Around here, they are less than 1/3 of the price you listed. With the amount you save, you could pay someone to do the modifications for the exterior light and install a new digital thermostat..... (and you could probably pick up a used unit for even less when the universities let out for the summer).

[Sebulon]

moof, on 4th January 2011 - 22:10 PM, said:

I must say I tought about a similar thing a year ago and almost bought it, but I decided to do the cooling like Martin Hingst did because I just couldn't find a way to install the light in a wine cooler like this one. The freezer method is ok for me but I really would like something more simple. I think that both replacing the "roof" with plexi or separating the light and getting the hot air outside needs some modifications to be done to the cooler. I think the first method would be better, the only thing is to figure out how to do it without harm to the cooler:) I hope we'll find a way to do it!

Peter

Yeah, it really depends on the cooler. If the roof was easy to take off, I wouldn't even think twice. I think Im going to the shop and have a look at the thing, only to be depressed.

I also think putting the lights inside the thing would be kinda silly, they would use plant space and heat the thing up. So I agree: the only question is, can I take the roof off without harming the machine?

RL7836, on 5th January 2011 - 00:11 AM, said:

Before spending that kind of money, you might want to consider buying a small refrigerator like they use in college dorms. Around here, they are less than 1/3 of the price you listed. With the amount you save, you could pay someone to do the modifications for the exterior light and install a new digital thermostat..... (and you could probably pick up a used unit for even less when the universities let out for the summer).

They could be really nice, but I think they are too small for me. I have a largish collection of highland utrics, plus some neps and helis, so I am gonna need some surface area. But maybe I could start experimenting with these, not a bad idea at all. Better have a look at some webshops that sell used stuff. These wouldn't be too expensive to do some Godzilla action on.

Greetings,
Jarkko

[mobile]

I looked into doing exactly the same thing a few time but have always been put off by the lighting. I took a detailed look at one in a local electrical store and couldn't work out a way of fixing lights either internally or externally without some modification involving either drilling holes or removing a large section from the top. As far as I could ascertain, it would need either fluorescent lamps inside, running vertically so as to evenly light the total height, or a metal halde lamp illuminating from the top. The metal halide would obviously have to be outside the cooler due to he heat produced and this could also possibly be the case with fluorescents, depending on whether the refrigeration was capable of the additional load. By far the cheapest source of these in the UK at the time of looking was on eBay. I think they are a bit of a impulse buy and as such they often end up for resale. A similar alternative is a beer fridge, often made by Husky, which also has a glass door.

[Sebulon]

mobile, on 5th January 2011 - 09:01 AM, said:

I looked into doing exactly the same thing a few time but have always been put off by the lighting. I took a detailed look at one in a local electrical store and couldn't work out a way of fixing lights either internally or externally without some modification involving either drilling holes or removing a large section from the top. As far as I could ascertain, it would need either fluorescent lamps inside, running vertically so as to evenly light the total height, or a metal halde lamp illuminating from the top. The metal halide would obviously have to be outside the cooler due to he heat produced and this could also possibly be the case with fluorescents, depending on whether the refrigeration was capable of the additional load. By far the cheapest source of these in the UK at the time of looking was on eBay. I think they are a bit of a impulse buy and as such they often end up for resale. A similar alternative is a beer fridge, often made by Husky, which also has a glass door.

Thanks a lot, I'll have a look at beer fridges too.

Just out of curiosity, what did you end up doing with your highland terrarium cooling?

EDIT: Is it hard to mod a fridge into a terrarium? Are the cooling cables usually located in the roof? If I bought an uber cheap fridge from a flea market, I could try doing some havoc tear-me-apart action.

Edited by Sebulon, 05 January 2011 - 09:38 AM.

[Zlatokrt]

Good idea Jarkko, i have a friend who often speaks about making a highland setup from wine refrigerator, but he does not grow highland species
I personally think, that lights like LED or so would not heat the space so much (if placed inside). It would also probably helped you to simulate day/night temperature drop. Light and warm during day and cold during night, what do you think? On the other hand, it would probably only force the cooling unit to raise power to cool down the inner space.  

And what about making only several holes (lets say about 3-5 cm in diameter) and place a 5W LED light in each hole? It would be much easier to do and it would also be more safe if you are afraid of damaging the refrigerator.

Where are you going to place it? You could also switch off the cooling unit during the day, if there would not be too hot.

I am also making a new highland setup, but i will have it in the basement, so i do not need the cooling unit. On the other side, i am going to place the lights inside, because i need to heat it up a little during the day to make some temperature difference.

EDIT: you could also use the power led tapes and stick them on the top of it. You just have to choose some water-resistant and powerful ones (both is possible).

Good luck!
Adam

Edited by Zlatokrt, 05 January 2011 - 09:39 AM.

[Sebulon]

Zlatokrt, on 5th January 2011 - 09:37 AM, said:

Good idea Jarkko, i have a friend who often speaks about making a highland setup from wine refrigerator, but he does not grow highland species
I personally think, that lights like LED or so would not heat the space so much (if placed inside). It would also probably helped you to simulate day/night temperature drop. Light and warm during day and cold during night, what do you think? On the other hand, it would probably only force the cooling unit to raise power to cool down the inner space.  

And what about making only several holes (lets say about 3-5 cm in diameter) and place a 5W LED light in each hole? It would be much easier to do and it would also be more safe if you are afraid of damaging the refrigerator.

Where are you going to place it? You could also switch off the cooling unit during the day, if there would not be too hot.

I am also making a new highland setup, but i will have it in the basement, so i do not need the cooling unit. On the other side, i am going to place the lights inside, because i need to heat it up a little during the day to make some temperature difference.

EDIT: you could also use the power led tapes and stick them on the top of it. You just have to choose some water-resistant and powerful ones (both is possible).

Good luck!
Adam

Hello Adam,

Im really inexperienced with LED lighting. I've always thought that they are really expensive? And I would have no idea about the specifics required for growing plants.

I just had a look at some super-cheap fridges. Maybe I could buy one and try seperating the cooling element, and just stick that into a terrarium like some people do.

Greetings,
Jarkko

[gardenofeden]

could you lay it horizontally and light through the door?

[mobile]

gardenofeden, on 5th January 2011 - 12:51 PM, said:

could you lay it horizontally and light through the door?

Typically manufacturers recommend that a fridge is kept upright. I believe this to be something to do with the compressor.

[moof]

That's true, you can't lay it horizontally, you shouldn't even transport them that way. As for the beer fridges - don't buy thermoelectric ones, they're too weak for our purposes. I think that the only way is to cut out a hole in it. Personally I've got the stuff needed to do it, but I'm just not sure if I won't destroy the refrigerator. I'll try to figure something out.

Peter

[mobile]

Just a thought, but what about a chest freezer? I'm pretty sure that there is no tubing in the top of these as they have a hinged lid. I should be relatively easy to cut out an aperture and fix clear polycarbonate sheet over it, maybe twin layers to help retain heat loss. Or maybe totally remove the lid and replace it with polycarbonate sheet. The thermostat might need a little modifying to increase the temperature.

[mobile]

Just remembered this: http://www.merklesor...rePgs/disa.html

[Sebulon]

mobile, on 5th January 2011 - 22:59 PM, said:

Just a thought, but what about a chest freezer? I'm pretty sure that there is no tubing in the top of these as they have a hinged lid. I should be relatively easy to cut out an aperture and fix clear polycarbonate sheet over it, maybe twin layers to help retain heat loss. Or maybe totally remove the lid and replace it with polycarbonate sheet. The thermostat might need a little modifying to increase the temperature.

I don't know about chest freezers. They might work, but if something happens you might find your plants frozen or something! The shape and idea of the freezer would be better though, although you wouldn't see your plants that much.

For the latter link, I don't really understand the system. Might be my english.

[mobile]

Sebulon, on 7th January 2011 - 21:12 PM, said:

For the latter link, I don't really understand the system. Might be my english.

The latter one is a chest freezer that has had the freezer compartment made waterproof. The freezer compartment is then filled with water, which gets chilled, and a pump delivers the chilled water into a tray in which the plants stand. The try is basically an ebb and flow system, where the water fills to a certain level then drains - this system is commonly used in hydroponics. A terrarium could be built over the tray.

[Sebulon]

mobile, on 7th January 2011 - 21:45 PM, said:

The latter one is a chest freezer that has had the freezer compartment made waterproof. The freezer compartment is then filled with water, which gets chilled, and a pump delivers the chilled water into a tray in which the plants stand. The try is basically an ebb and flow system, where the water fills to a certain level then drains - this system is commonly used in hydroponics. A terrarium could be built over the tray.

Ahh, thanks for explaining it. It's strange that the water doesn't freeze in the chest freezer. And if you put a terrarium over the system, could you adjust the night and day temperatures separately? Is the whole freezer on a thermostat, or is only the pump controlled with a thermostat? Because what I understood, I think it chills the system continuously, not only when it pumps water.

Although the Hingst system could be used with this thing, just put the tubing in the freezer, and the radiator in the terrarium. That would be uber cool.

[kisscool_38]

Here are some pictures of mine. I think it will probably answer to some of your questions. It is a small wine fridge with a glass door. Light inside is provided by LED which advantage is that they don't produce any heat. I chose a panel consisting of blue and red LED, the wavelengths best absorbed by chlorophyll. Light and cooling periods are controlled by 2 timers. Temperatures are between 14°C when lights are off and 23°C when lights are on and cooling is begining. I am growing in this "terrarium" some tricky Utricularia such as Utricularia campbelliana, Utricularia quelchi, Utricularia praetermissa. Light is also enough for some south american Drosera but not for temperate  sundews. There are also some mexican butterworts in it.








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Regards

Aymeric

Edited by kisscool_38, 08 January 2011 - 23:36 PM.

[moof]

Thanks for a lot for your help, interesting setup! Everything's great and all but growLEDs are very expensive, what was the price you paid for yours if I can ask? Are the plants getting enough light to grow well in your opinion? What sundews do you grow in there?

Peter

[Sebulon]

kisscool_38, on 8th January 2011 - 23:33 PM, said:

Here are some pictures of mine. I think it will probably answer to some of your questions. It is a small wine fridge with a glass door. Light inside is provided by LED which advantage is that they don't produce any heat. I chose a panel consisting of blue and red LED, the wavelengths best absorbed by chlorophyll. Light and cooling periods are controlled by 2 timers. Temperatures are between 14°C when lights are off and 23°C when lights are on and cooling is begining. I am growing in this "terrarium" some tricky Utricularia such as Utricularia campbelliana, Utricularia quelchi, Utricularia praetermissa. Light is also enough for some south american Drosera but not for temperate  sundews. There are also some mexican butterworts in it.








Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Regards

Aymeric

Wow, wonderful setup Aymeric! I second Peter with some questions: how much did the LEDs cost? I can imagine the electrical cost itself isn't huge. And do the plants really get everything they need from 2 different lights? Are the plants happy there, flowering? Is it enough for epiphytic utrics, as I've been planning my system mainly for them?

But nice looking setup, reminds me of an oven!

Greetings,
Jarkko

[kisscool_38]

Sebulon, on 9th January 2011 - 12:32 PM, said:

Wow, wonderful setup Aymeric! I second Peter with some questions: how much did the LEDs cost?

150 euros for this one, quite twice the price of a turboneon kit. But it has a longer life time, and replacing one LED is much cheaper than one turboneon tube.

Sebulon, on 9th January 2011 - 12:32 PM, said:

I can imagine the electrical cost itself isn't huge.

40W. Compared to 2 X 55W, this is much cheaper.
In addition, you have to consider that all wavelengths are absorbed by the plants (this is why they look black), and not only the blue and red ones (and emit the other ones, that's why plants look green under white light). So those LED have a much better yield.

Sebulon, on 9th January 2011 - 12:32 PM, said:

And do the plants really get everything they need from 2 different lights? Are the plants happy there, flowering? Is it enough for epiphytic utrics, as I've been planning my system mainly for them?

Yes, leaves of epiphytic utrics are much thicker in those conditions than in my terrarium for Nepenthes and Heliamphora. They grow faster and healthier too. It is too early for flowers, I made this system during late summer.

Quote

What sundews do you grow in there?

For the moment, there are Drosera tomentosa var. glabrata, Drosera chrysolepis, Drosera meristocaulis and Drosera kaiteuriensis.

Regards

Aymeric