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Inermis seeds germinating


lesthegringo
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Guys, I bought some seeds from a grower in Thailand just out of curiosity to see if I could get them to grow. There are some N x Viking, N Maxima, N Inermis and N Dubia.

 

They weren't expensive as the guy said that since he doesn't pollinate them, they could be crossed with anything in his growing house, so all I know is the mother plant. Since this was more curiosity to see if I could do it I was happy to give it a go, and get what I get at the end of it.

 

Against all expectations, after only 32 days, I already have at least 10 of the Inermis seeds germinating. It is incredibly difficult to see them, let alone try and photograph them, so sorry I can't post photos yet. But I'm chuffed to bits that they germinated at all, after reading so many accounts of failed attempts to get them to germinate, and especially so at the speed with which they have done so. None of the other seeds have shown any signs yet, but I'm hopeful.

 

In case anyone is interested, I sowed them on a coir / perlite mix (about 3:1 ratio) onto which I scattered chopped up live sphagnum. The pots were the little seed pots with some LFS at the bottom to prevent the coir being washed out. I had left the pots with the live sphagnum a couple of weeks, and the sphagnum was starting to put out new growth, and that's when I sowed the seeds. I was worried about fungus attack and fungus gnat larvae munching what was left, so I treated the pots with a furalaxyl fungicide (the brand name here is Fongarid) and an Imidacloprid based insect killer (brand name Hortico) before sowing. Neither seem to affect the sphagnum. After sowing I sprayed again with the fungicide to make sure that the seeds were clean. I then just put them on the shelves of my heated greenhouse (25C day, 15C night) where they could be misted daily by the automatic misting system. No tray underneath as I thought that, like all my plants, that the best way would be to let the water run through.

 

As I was concerned about the fungus gnats coming back after a while due to the other pots harbouring them, I went round and sprayed the soil in all the pots in the greenhouse as a precaution. This really seems to have worked, as there are now virtually no fungus gnats in the greenhouse.

 

Anyway, I know that just because they germinate that it doesn't mean that everything will be fine, as they are supposed to have a high mortality rate even after germination, but hey, I'm happy so far!

 

I also saved a few seeds and put those into tissue culture medium to see if they do any better, they were sown a few weeks later so nothing has happened with those yet. Watch this space

 

Les

Edited by lesthegringo
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Incredibly, I have a load of seeds sprouting now, all sending down tiny shoots into the sphagnum. None are yet putting out the cotyledons, and as this is the first time I have grown Nepenthes seed I have no idea how long it will take for them to do so.

Having followed a number of threads both here and on other sites, a common theme seems to be people thinking that they are over watering the young seedlings, so I have decided to reduce the time that my misting system is on for. Not sure if that is being over cautious, but I can manually supplement the watering for the other plants plus it gives me an excuse to go out and pore over the pots.

I have been so encouraged by this that I have bought some more seeds, supposedly N Jamban and N Jacquelineae plus a mix of unnamed seeds from some unknown parentage hybrids.

Something that surprised me (but probably shouldn't have) was the difference in size and shape of the seeds. The N Inermis (if that's what they really are) seeds were the biggest, with a very well defined seed embryo on the middle of two long filaments and about 15mm long. The maxima seeds were the same shape, but smaller, maybe 10mm long and the seed embryo a bit smaller in proportion; they were darker, too, where the Inermis ones were golden brown. The Dubia seeds were tiny, maybe 6mm long and with a hardly descernible seed embryo, and again dark coloured. The Viking ones looked nothing like the others, resembling little orangy brown blades about 8mm long, and you couldn't see a distinct seed embryo at all.

So far, then, the seeds with the most pronounced embryo are the ones that have sprouted first. It will be interesting to see if the pattern follows the size, although trying to spot the N Dubia seeds is very difficult indeed. I suspect it will only be if they germinate that I will be sure of what I am looking at!

I would be interested in anyones experience in terms of time from initial sprouting to leaf formation, and also whether they found the bigger seeds germinated faster

Les

Edited by lesthegringo
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  • 2 weeks later...

Even more happy now, some of the N jacquelineae seeds have started to germinate, and very quickly after they were sown.

Quite a few of the inermis seedlings have their first leaves, so they are coming along nicely too.

None of the others have shown any signs of life though, and the inermis and jacquelineae seeds I have sown in vitro have also not done anything yet. I have nothing to lose by just leaving them to it, with luck eventually I may get something else sprouting

Les

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  • 2 weeks later...

I'm happy to report that I have continued to have success with germinating Nepenthes seeds. After my initial lot sprouted I gained a bit of confidence and splashed out some more seeds. Now, you can only go by what you are told but if the description of the seeds is correct, I now have N Jacquelineae, Talangensis, Bongso and some highland hybrid seeds sprouting, the latter also in vitro as well as in traditional media.

The N Maxima, Dubia and Viking seeds have not yet done anything, and in fact in the case of the Dubia, I can't even see the seeds in the media any more. I'm sure that they are there, but they have blended in so well with the coir that they are invisible. However, I have (with the exception of N Bongso - not enough seeds) also planted some of the seeds from each batch in vitro, so those I can see. Interestingly, the seeds in vitro are taking longer to germinate, which especially in the case of N Inermis and N Jacquelieae is a surprise considering how many and how quickly they have germinated in the traditional media. The fact that the mixed hybrid seeds sown in vitro at the same time have germinated shows that fundementally there is nothing wrong with the in vitro process I followed, so I'm curious to see what eventually happens with these.

Anyway, I'm the proud owner (for now) of about 200 nepenthes seedlings, now I just have to keep the little buggers alive!

Les

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Wow it is nice experiment. I am sure that this will be useful information in germinating nepenthes seeds. Growing more than 200 could bug but it must be very rewarding and joyful process. ! I hope that I will grow my N seeds well ! They must be a very fancy collection of nepenthes!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Edited by fksdl421
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I can now add three N Jamban sprouts to that tally, and also now have some N Jacquelineae sprouting in vitro, and lots of the mixed hybrid seeds germinating in vitro too.

 

Still no Dubia, Viking (after thinking one was sprouting and it turned out to be mould) and Maxima, the latter surprising me as I thought it would be one of the easier to grow varieties. Also, despite the amazing success I had with the N Inermis seeds, none have sprouted in vitro, couldn't even begin to understand why.

 

For info, there is definitely a correlation between germination and live sphagnum, where the sphagnum is not present in the pots, there is markedly less success in the percentage of seeds that sprout. As a result I am pre-preparing lots of pots with the mix above and dressing the tops with chopped live sphagnum, which I will let grow a while before sowing any seeds on.

 

I have managed to order some N Lowii seed from a seed supplier in Europe, which I have to confess I don't really have much optimism about them being viable, but as they were the only ones I could buy anywhere, I thought I would give them a go. By the time they arrive I should have some good sphagnum to plant them on, wish me luck!

 

Les

Edited by lesthegringo
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Pictures!

 

Great to read you've been succesful sprouting a lot of Nep seeds. Beware, though, the hard part is still to come. At least, that has been my limited experience. After sprouting a ton of N. albomarginata seeds for the first time last year I've had a bit of trouble keeping them alive. I think I kept 'm too wet and killed off a bunch. I still have maybe about 40 left, but I can only say that about 5 of them look really healthy and are doing good. The rest, meh.

 

But I'd really like to see some pictures. And saying that, maybe I should try to put up some of my own on a thread here... :wink: :smile:

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This site won't allow direct posting of pictures, so I'll have to work out how to do it - having said that, they are photos of lots of sphagnum with tiny little leaves! Once I work out how to do I'll post some pictures.

The in vitro pictures are more difficult because of the shape of the containers and the size, but my wife reckons her iPhone can take photos of that

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Yeah, good pictures of plants is hard to do anyway. Start looking at doing good pictures of just germinated seedlings and it gets a whole lot harder.

 

But I'm interested in the progression of Nepenthes seedlings. Haven't really been able to find any pictures of a progression from seed to plant(let). Would be interesting to see.

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Well, they are slow growers, so it gives you plenty of time to work out how to do it!

 

970_zps0zmkdb2m.jpg

 

These are the Inermis sprouts

 

964_zpsecu3i0z5.jpg

 

These are the Viking seeds, with what I thought was a germinating seed, later turned out to be fungus - can't win them all

 

079_zpsnk4fne3j.jpg

 

A Talangensis sprout, not that you could tell any difference if it wasn't for the label in the pot

 

I will try and take some pics of the in vitro sprouts

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Cool. Looking good. I've had quite a bit of trouble with fungus, mold, and algea. Quite a few of my albomarginata's have miniature pitchers on their leaves already.

 

I'll see if I can get some pictures up, too.

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The only big problem I have had with fungus has been with some of the in vitro jars, when mould from a seed that obviously wasn't sterilised well enough grows quickly. Two out of three times i can just cut out the affected area with a sterile spoon, but the other times you lose the entire jar as it spreads fast over the rest of the media. I would say that one jar in ten has developed some mould, but i have only lost three entire jars to mould so far, leaving a good proportion completely clean.

On the sphagnum, I get individual seeds that go mouldy, but i just remove them and it seems the sphagnum acts to contain it. What I can't tell is how many seeds decompose without rotting, as I have mentioned my Dubia seeds have vanished in the sphagnum so I don't know if they are still viable.

Whatever, I have to say that what I thought would be really difficult has turned out a lot 'easier' than I expected. I would really encourage anyone to try growing them, for me the most difficult part has been having the patience to just let them get on with it. If you already grow nepenthes, like I do, just keep them in the same place, I didn't put them anywhere special.

As for the in vitro experiment (and trust me that is what it is) that also has vastly exceeded my expectations, and while not as simple as sowing on sphagnum was nowhere near as troublesome as I initially thought. Yes, cleanliness and careful preparation is necessary, but with the tissue culture starter kit sold by stoker128 plus his great videos I had no problems. The only caveat to that is that you need a clean atmosphere to work in so you have to make a laminar flow cabinet. I made my own for about 150 aus dollars (75 quid) from a cheap HEPA filter and a big plastic storage box. Without it you run the risk of more mould attacks.

After all this, they may all turn out to be unspectacular plants with no particularly outstanding characteristics, but I don't care. I'll love 'em all the same!

Edited by lesthegringo
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Well, updates coming thick and fast now

Firstly, I can see some action from some of the N Dubia in one of the coir/perlite/live sphagnum pots. Three tiny spouts have appeared, some two months after sowing. Too small to take any pictures of, of course but hopefully in a couple of weeks they will be big enough. If it wasn't for the greeny white shoot, you would not know anything was there, even though I know it is there the seed is invisible to my eyes. No correlating in vitro sprouts though.

Maxima and Viking are not showing signs.

As for what has already sprouted, this is the photo I took of some mixed Nepenthes in vitro on the 20th July.

20150721_094423_zpslcx670ev.jpg

And these are the same sprouts on the 25th - quite a change, and apparently faster than the equivalent plantlets in traditional media

20150725_103430_zpsttjajqd7.jpg

Edited by lesthegringo
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  • 2 weeks later...

Some new photos taken this morning of the mixed Nepenthes

 

20150802_102607_zpsndqsiwmi.jpg

 

As you can see they have formed the cotyledons

 

Here are some of the N Jacqueline sprouts, just forming the first true leaves with proto-pitchers

20150802_120425_zpskshkxnxj.jpg

 

And the N Inermis seedlings

 

20150802_120502_zps5ksgskam.jpg

Edited by lesthegringo
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Same highland mixed seeds a week later taken from the top

 

20150808_093009_zps6rqlobtm.jpg

 

This is apparently a N Stenophylla seed germinating - you have to look closely to see it, and it is the only one

 

20150808_092830_zps3r4eqh36.jpg

 

An N Albomarginata seedling just peeking out, again it's the only one so far

 

20150808_092335_zpspixboilq.jpg

 

A N Dubia seedling, one of only three so far, although I think one may be starting to germinate in vitro

 

20150808_092227_zpsvgksx7ka.jpg

 

N Inermis with quite well defined first true leaf, and after nearly six weeks after the first seeds germinated on traditional media, I have now seen some Inermis seeds starting to sprout in vitro

 

20150808_092159_zpsfdelefpe.jpg

 

And some N Jacqueline seedlngs with true leaves, still only the one seed germinating in vitro

 

20150802_120502_zpsdumejzgv.jpg

 

So generally very positive, however it is not all good news. Mould has struck in some of the in-vitro jars, and when it hits it is fast. Some batches of seed are worse than others, where sometimes an individual seed starts to develop a fungal bloom. By carefully cutting it out with a sterelised spoon I have been able to save some, however sometimes I am not so lucky. Some batches are just covered in spores that you don't know are there, and I have looked at a jar three days apart and found the jar completely enveloped by a fine white fungal bloom. Others develop a red - pink bloom that has a lacy appearance.

 

When this happens I have no choice but to rinse the seeds off to remove the gel, and hopefully most of the mould, then a dip into H2O2 to try and re-sterelise the seeds and then I put them on live sphagnum. Maybe I can save them, time will tell. I have two jars with sprouting seeds that also have fungal blooms, I am still considering what to do with these, but suspect I will end up doing the same as with the seeds. They are mostly of the mixed hybrids, which have been more successful that I dared hope so if I lose them it won't be a disaster, but I want to try for two reasons - 1) I want to find a method to save seedlings that I don't have many seedlings of and 2) I'm a greedy bugger who wants as many beautiful Nepenthes plants as possible!

 

I'll try and get some pictures of the jars with the bloom to show people what I am talking about.

Anyway, wish me l​uck, maybe I can come up with something that helps other people

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Oh sorry for one of ur jar with fungi. But other seeds in ur picture look healthy without any fungi ! Great great Good luck to ur seedlings! I hope to see ur nice collection of nepenthes in future !

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Edited by fksdl421
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This is what it can look like when it goes wrong - these are Reintwardiana, and all the Reintwardiana seed sown in vitro jars have fungal bloom, so they must have been contaminated while still in the pod on the plant

 

11846456_928195550571193_348007278_n%201

 

Horrible, isn't it?

 

Interestingly, the seeds sown on sphagnum do not suffer any where near as much, I think the sphagnum has some anti fungal properties

Edited by lesthegringo
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