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N. ampullaria compact growth

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A few quick snaps of my N. ampullaria whilst it was outside its amp tank. As you can see, growth remains compact, which I suspect is due to the high light levels I grow it under:

 

15181463697_68f889b60b_b.jpgSS855935 by Carl Leach, on Flickr

 

15367975185_054fed9f65_b.jpgSS855946 by Carl Leach, on Flickr

 

15364812101_d6b17fc82b_b.jpgSS855937 by Carl Leach, on Flickr

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Very nice plant and I always admire N. amp but the lowland plants almost die here in the winter in the greenhouse. How u manage to keep yours happy in the cool UK conditions?

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Dimitar, it has artificial lighting and heating all year. There is a low wattage heater below and a COB LED above.6f133c322015449b9df41b641dc087f5.jpg

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Ohhh I love that amp! Interesting that while you have high light level the leaves are mostly green. My amp gets very red leaves but it's quite young still so no idea on compact growth. Got some basal pitchers still! And it's only a year old or so.

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A few quick snaps of my N. ampullaria whilst it was outside its amp tank. As you can see, growth remains compact, which I suspect is due to the high light levels I grow it under:

 

15181463697_68f889b60b_b.jpgSS855935 by Carl Leach, on Flickr

 

15367975185_054fed9f65_b.jpgSS855946 by Carl Leach, on Flickr

 

15364812101_d6b17fc82b_b.jpgSS855937 by Carl Leach, on Flickr

 

 

In my experience, amps don't start vining until the leaves reach about 8" long. Ordinarily, the vining seems to start, at least for me, prior to the creation of basals, but, in your case, it looks like your plant has already created a basal, which I find interesting.

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In my experience, amps don't start vining until the leaves reach about 8" long. Ordinarily, the vining seems to start, at least for me, prior to the creation of basals, but, in your case, it looks like your plant has already created a basal, which I find interesting.

 

I'm not so sure that it has formed a basal. I think all of the pitchers are on leaves, but I have not trimmed the Sphagnum for some time, so I could be wrong. I got these as cuttings about a year ago and it has stayed compact during that time, I have never trimmed it. Martin Hingst has the same results with his: http://www.cpukforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=46715 

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Well, looking at this thread and a couple of others, I'm sorely tempted to try a Nep.

 

I have a 'terrarium' that is 90x30x40 (lwh). It is heated to 21-24 and is very humid. D. adelae grows OK in there along with some Utrics.

 

Would I be OK with N. ampullaria or gracillis then? I can up the heat if I need to.

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Well, looking at this thread and a couple of others, I'm sorely tempted to try a Nep.

 

I have a 'terrarium' that is 90x30x40 (lwh). It is heated to 21-24 and is very humid. D. adelae grows OK in there along with some Utrics.

 

Would I be OK with N. ampullaria or gracillis then? I can up the heat if I need to.

Temperature probably ok but, in my experience, if you do not provide high light levels it'll soon outgrow a terrarium

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Temperature probably ok but, in my experience, if you do not provide high light levels it'll soon outgrow a terrarium

I think high light does encourage basals, although most amps are pretty big plants and good climbers. The compact growth i would guess (and relatively pale green leaves) is either due to the particular clone or not enough nutrients, i used to grow mine under a 250W envirolight but now try and give them as much natural light as possible, including sunlight when possible.

.

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There are two different clones in my pics, so less likely that the compact growth is due to a particular clone. I don't add any nutrients, so may be due to that. The light I give them is extremely intense, with it being very close to the plants.

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Carl, there are some burns on the leaf i'm guessing from the LED, thats a problem ive seen on plants before with high LED light levels. I think you have a bonsai amp, lol, with a few nutrients you might see a burst in growth.

Edited by manders

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Those aren't burns. I received the two amps from a friend, as cuttings. One of them did not root so I took it out of the tank, wrapped the stem in sphagnum and put it in a bag at the back of my grow shelf. I then pretty much forgot about it until one day I noticed it was still alive, but the leaves weren't looking too healthy, having gotten those brown spots you can see. Deciding to give it another go, I shortened the stem, cut a few notches in it, and put it back in the tank. The LED light I use is a COB LED, which does not have the same issues as the very focused lighting you get from single LED, which can lead to burning leaves.

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Temperature probably ok but, in my experience, if you do not provide high light levels it'll soon outgrow a terrarium

 

I take it that without sufficient light they stretch toward whatever is available? What do you class as high light levels?

 

Truth to be told my current set up isn't even colouring up heliamphora so I doubt that you would class it as high. 

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I use a 21W COB LED downlighter which, as you can see from the pictures, is very close to the plant. I've never tired growing a Heliamphora under it, however I would expect one to colour up if I did.

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Amps go pretty high altitude wise, so I would image their are cold tolerant/intermediate amps out there, I am not sure High light is the reason for compact growth, I have 2 of my amps outside in full sun from 9am-3-4pm and they grow fast, but in winter they slow right down.

My amp green were seed grown and went from 2inch rossetes to 1foot vines in a 6month time frame, my flecked amps did the same, but I got them when they where already 2-3inch.

You said they are cuttings, I have a small mirabilis cutting that I took whilst small (3inch), in over a year it has only grown to a 3-4inch diameter and made 5-6leaves that are very compact, perhaps this is not conditions but rather it was stunted.

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Take a look at Martin Hingst's amps linked in an earlier post in this thread. They have stayed compact for many years. We both grow the same two clones, so either the two clones are both dwarf varieties, or there are some environmental conditions in play. Apart from the clones, the other thing in common is we both use strong artificial lighting.

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I notice both yours and martins are in live sphagnum? This would reduce the nutrients available to allmost nothing. Often where they grow wild they get normal forest leaf litter and very good light and get very big...

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Mine is in a mix of Sphagnum moss and orchid bark. It was more bark than moss to start with, but the moss has grown since.

I can't be totally sure if why it stays small, but hopefully it'll continue, as it suits my growing conditions, and tastes.

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Martin Hingst's amps cant be in to much light, in one pic he has D.adelae with them showing very little reddening, although there are varieties that show more red or green than other adelae, all show reddening in high light. 

 

Also Manders, I have some of my amp "green" in spag and sand (2:1) and they grow fast, granted slower then the same clone in sand/peat/bark, but still fast.

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Maybe the quality of the light in some way then? Sometimes when i take things out of a terrarium and put them in sunlight theres a big jump in growth rate.

These where grown under (and close to) 250w envirolites, the high light does encourage basals (with tiny leaves) but theres allways a vining stem apears sooner or later, usually before the basals.

4941429162_af39014a20_z.jpg

Edited by manders
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It could be the quality of light. I'm using daylight LED and it receives only incidental natural light. Despite initial looks, mine has not formed any basals, rather the pitchers are on short leaves.

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My plants all get sunlight, as I am tropical I can keep them outside year round, butI am still leaning towards stunted.

 

Otherwise what if your plants are from a high elevation (1800-2000M marks) and most in cultivation are from lower elevations (0-1000), they would naturally grow slower when compared to other amps would they not?

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They are sort of stunted.  They are what is called bonsai.  It was not done by the normal way of pruning the roots, but the small pots and mossy conditions of the soil have had the same effect more naturally.

 

I think this is what McPherson calls an "ecophene"?

Edited by Dave Evans

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I do not think the Sphagnum has anything to do with it. It is just a top dressing in my pots (that arent that small either; 20cm square pots, quite deep)

Lack of nutrients cant be the point either. I give them a spray with liquid fertiliser about monthly, from time to time I even add Osmocote to the soil.

 

Light level is 600W/mof high output fluorescents, in 15cm distance. Plus the sun in the afternoon, at least in summer. Wouldnt call it low light.

 

I am quite sure it is not up to the clone either, as my tricolor shows the same growth.

 

I am quite sure the combination of hight light level with moderate low temps (for a lowlander; just around 20-25°C) is one of the main reasons for this growth habit.

 

Some more recent pics I have posted here: http://www.cpukforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=51636&hl=

 

14403498039_a87570b67a_h.jpg

 

Regards

 

Martin

 

Nice ones Carl, btw :-)

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