bugmuncher Posted May 5, 2014 Report Share Posted May 5, 2014 hi guys and girls i have a couple of sarracenia which are about to flower for the first time , i would like to cross pollinate them but not sure how to go about doing it , can anyone give me any tips please thanks Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexis Posted May 5, 2014 Report Share Posted May 5, 2014 On flower one, lift a petal and scoop up the pollen in the umbrella with a paintbrush. On flower two, dab the five stigmas with the paintbrush. They are the bump on each of the five inner 'arms' of the umbrella. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bugmuncher Posted May 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 5, 2014 thanks for the reply , is it possible for sarracenia to self pollinate ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenofeden Posted May 5, 2014 Report Share Posted May 5, 2014 you mean by themselves? sometimes, if they are outside and get blown around, but they are designed to prevent this. If you mean can you pollinate a flower with its own pollen, then yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexis Posted May 6, 2014 Report Share Posted May 6, 2014 Best to avoid inbreeding! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Salter Posted May 6, 2014 Report Share Posted May 6, 2014 (edited) Best to avoid inbreeding!I'm sorry but have to disagree. Selfed plants can produce interesting results and display recessive traits like anthocyanin free plants. For example MK-PP6 S. purpurea ssp purpurea is actually heterozygous, I discovered this after the plant was selfed with the seedlings being a percent of anthocyanin free plants. In the wild many populations will be proportunately hybrids either directly or distantly apart from remote populations of single genera as far as I know. Natural selection will always favour diversity and yes you can get weaker offspring but it is still nice to see what is in there. I think every apparent variety, form or subspecies should be selfed the one time just for the hell of it and because you just never know. Just my non academic opinion. What are your thoughts guys? Ian. Edited May 6, 2014 by Ian Salter 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mantrid Posted May 6, 2014 Report Share Posted May 6, 2014 Self pollination (selfing) is a common practice in plant breeding for the reason you stated i.e. it reveals recessive characteristics that are hidden in the heterozygous form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ada Posted May 6, 2014 Report Share Posted May 6, 2014 I have to agree with Ian,Alexis. We have been here before, Â Inbreeding concentrates the good and bad genes. You can and do get a lot of rubbish plants produced but you might just get a stunner! Â Don't forget even crossing two unrelated beautiful sarracenia will produce a lot of average looking plants. ada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexis Posted May 6, 2014 Report Share Posted May 6, 2014 Ah, I was just under the impression you've got more chance of a greater number of poorer individuals. I've never tried selfing, just assuming you'd have less chance of producing something decent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Salter Posted May 6, 2014 Report Share Posted May 6, 2014 Ah, I was just under the impression you've got more chance of a greater number of poorer individuals. I've never tried selfing, just assuming you'd have less chance of producing something decent.You are right Alexis and if for example you self an S. flava var flava you may well get all similar offspring but then others may produce more variability and occasionally the odd freak or strange colour. I have collected seed from a few open pollinated plants one namely S. flava var flava,Dinwiddie Bog, not knowing if this was crossed or selfed I have regardless grown the seedlings on and although a majority have the characteristic shape there are a few that are all green as in var maxima but it is early yet for final colour. Ian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cedric-666 Posted May 29, 2014 Report Share Posted May 29, 2014 I agree with mantrid that in some cases it is worth to try selfing, in order to unveil recessive character states.  My first pollinisation attempt (several years ago) was selfing a bad clone of moorei. The resulting plants were not strong growers but they included two nice plants, far more beautiful than their mother-father.  After that, I selfed S. flava 'Slack's maxima'. The resulting seedlings are extremely vigorous, well over average Sarracenia seedlings.  Last year, I selfed the mythic S. x Adrian Slack, with over 100 seeds as a result. So far, I have got a bad rate of germination (only 20 seedlings). They are not very strong, but not truly weak either. Anyway, my objective here was not to create strong growers but beautiful plants. I will be patient and give them their chance.  So selfing may result in weaker plants, but not always. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billynomates666 Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 I agree that selfing does provide some interesting specimens and hold genes that are useful.  Out of interest I was watching the bees at work on my outdoor Sarrs yesterday, a large number of the bees I watched flew in from outside the bog area and proceeded to do the things bees do, and in the manner that the one way system that is the sarracenia flower, allows. Now these critters seem to want to mess up the flower design by going in, coming out, then moving round the same flower and going back in again, one of them did this six times to the same flower. So a conclusion is that the flower is designed not to 'self' itself but no one has told the pollinaters the rules. I grow a lot of my open pollinated seed just because I enjoy the fun and the lottery of it, but it does make you wonder how many are their own parents.  Cheers Steve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mantrid Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 , but it does make you wonder how many are their own parents. Â Cheers Steve not sure what you mean by that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amar Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 (edited) I think he means that when you have a pure species (non-hybrid), the question arises: Is this plant the product of self-pollination, or are mother and father two individual plants. Edited June 11, 2014 by Amar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kepikimut Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 sorry to bring this thread up. i wonder what the best time to harvest the pollen if i want to crossbreed? and when the time to pollinate it to stigma? at morning? noon? afternoon? thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ada Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 for a good seed set, i pollinate my sarras a couple of times if i can but once is enough. I only get time after work,so mine are done in the afternoon when it is warmer. ada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kepikimut Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 thanks ada for your info. how long we can keep the pollen in the refrigerator? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ada Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 I have tried this three times. Twice for a week just in the fridge and both these attempts failed. This year i tried storing the pollen in the freezer for 1 month,i am still waiting for the seed pods to ripen. I am not hopeful though,as this clone has never produced any seed that i know of. ada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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