Sales & Wants Forums Probation Peroid


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At the moment we have a 30 day probation period for new members before they can see the Sales & Wants Forums. After the 30 days members become full members and can see and read the Sales & Wants Forums.

Full members can not post in the Sales & Wants Forums until they have made 20 posts in other parts of the forum.

Here is a poll to see what members want.

Do you want no probation period for new members?

Do you want just a 30 Day Probation Period?

Do you want just a Minimum of 20 Posts?

Do you want a 30 Day Probation Period and Minimum of 20 Posts?

Please Vote

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I'm not sure that 20 posts is more than a token gesture as one would imagine it is easy to say "Hi!" 20 times.

There are forums that require 50 posts before you can take part in sales but these are usually higher value items.

Lol You could scrap the probation and require 10 thumbs up before trading can commence and a future drop below 10 suspends trading.

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As a current "Probie" I think that the 30 days and 20 posts is about right. Most other forums I have been on havent had limits but have had a stark warning in the sticky of the sales thread saying "Buying from new members or members with no feedback is stupid and is done at your own risk" .. fair enough stopping Probies from selling on the forum but I think buying for new members should be up to the individual seller, kind of like on ebay where a lot of people say "I will not accept bids from users with 0 feedback"

Just my 10 cents, as a noob haha.

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I think the warning about buying from new members is all thats needed.

Most people will employ this stratagy through common sense, or if you are doing a swap with a new member then wait until you recieve their plants before sending yours. Maybe this should be made an official recommendation for the forum.

At the end of the day if someone is dodgy and wants to rip people off, the probation period just delays them and nothing else.

Also a 20 posts threshold is also not going to deter someone who stands to aquire £100s of plants through deception.

Edited by mantrid
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I agree with Ian and Will. It's very easy to submit 20 posts that don't really contribute anything to the CP/CPUK community.

How about a minimum reputation score? It it would mean that people have to actually click the thumbs up or thumbs down for each post they enjoy or otherwise, but it would also mean that new members need to be seen to be making a valid contribution...

BTW I voted for the last option, in the absence of any other option!

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They are all valid points but there will always be something wrong with whatever I do. There's always something someone doesn't like or agrees with.

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Isn't it really a problem with sellers not buyers. If you sell to anybody (not just a new member) surely you wait until the funds are received before sending any plants? So what we really need is a probation on selling not buying, so can we have the Sales forum read-only for 30 days rather than block it entirely?

Cheers,

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Andy you have to admit that the problem here wasn't a sales one it was a swap. I truly agree newcomers should be on probation from selling and swapping but their money is the same as the rest of us when it comes to making a purchase.

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30 posts. BUT I still hold with what I've voiced before, that is; new members shouldn't be able to sell or swap/trade plants, BUT they should be allowed to purchase plants (providing payment is received by seller first) at any stage even in the probation period.

I haven't cast a vote on the poll as it doesn't give me an option to state what I have done here.

Edited by Richard Bunn
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I’ve not really voiced my opinion on this topic yet, so I’ll keep this as brief as I can (whilst remembering all the points I wanted to raise).

Firstly, I don’t agree with the reputation score, partly because I’ve never used it, and haven’t used the ‘thumbs up’ button so I’m sure that other members don’t do either and that could lead to an uneven playing field of those who do and those do not.

I’d agree with Martin’s post suggesting a probation period for selling and not buying, but I don’t know if this is technically possible. Andy?

Despite all of this, should there be no probation at all? If someone has a plant that I want to buy, why not, whoever they are. As long as a warning is placed on the S/W sticky stating that buying from new members could be dodgy, if the seller has plants that are of interest to members, do we need to police it? Carnivorous plants for sale on a CP forum aren’t a bad idea, its OK to sell plants (in my case so I can buy more) and I understand that some people do it for profit.

I’ve voted for a minimum of 20 posts, mainly because I don’t have the answer, but to be honest I don’t really see what a time delay will really achieve.

Andy, you’re doing a great job, you can please all the people some of the time, some of the people all the time, but not all the people all of the time.

Cheers

Alex.

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Firstly I am sorry if my blunt comments elsewhere on this aspect of the forum have caused offence.

As a newcomer I dont know what aggro went before to cause this dual citizenship.

But I think it may have been down to bad sellers and peeps only signing up to sell / further their own ends

in which case

to cut a long story short

I agree with linuxman, Richard and Alexa

Allow new buyers with, as they say, funds transferred before goods are dispatched ,

but either limit new sellers or put warnings upon them, but if we are all adults can we not apply our own caveats emptor to new sellers ? Does everything on the internet have to come via nanny states ?

( But for me at the mo it is all academic cos till NatWest starts talking to Paypal, and till I can see what NatWest has done wrt Paypal I cant do nowt ! And I dont see NatWest getting it all sorted even by monday ! )

And Andy, you are doing a great job, it may all appear to be lowflying brickbats but just dodg'em we all love you really ;)

Malcolm.

Edited by MalcolmP
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They are all valid points but there will always be something wrong with whatever I do. There's always something someone doesn't like or agrees with.

You are pretty much screwed whatever way you tackle problems on here Andy as we all have different ideas as we all come from different walks of life.

All you can ever do is the best you can or go with the general consensus or just say "bugger you lot it's my forum and I'll do what I want".

You have a great forum here and everybody will agree with that, if we all got on and agreed and had the same idea then it would just be plain boring. Easier, but boring.

Everyone give Andy a 'Thumbs up' (You too Alexa)

Regards Ian.

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Definitely a thumbs up is due to Andy. A forum is a behemoth and running it is something that goes mainly unnoticed. It's a hell of a lot of work. I've been there, having been a moderator on Yahoo's top tropical fish group for years plus I used to own an entire website & forum for a county-wide community group (sadly due to health I'm had to hand all of these tasks over). This work is hard and it's a thankless task. People don't realise the amount of time it takes to do this stuff. All the moderators deserve credit.

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Hi Andy

As a newbie here myself i thought i'd get involved!

As yourself and Ian know through recent experience, albeit limited, just because i,m new to the site doesn't mean i'm here to rip anyone off.

As said though there will always rogue's trying to get something for nothing.

I've always felt the "feedback" system such as on ebay was a pretty good measure.

I personally wouldn't expect anyone on this site with a good reputation dealing with me as a newbie to send me anything until they'd received from me first.

Many thanks

Blocky71

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We are all adults and know how the world works. There can be too much nannying and we see it all around us.

I think all that is required is two pieces of advice in bold red letters at the front of the sales and wants forum

Do not buy off new members until they have a history of posting.

effectively the same as a probation period without it being forced on anyone

If swapping with new members wait until you recieve their plants before sending yours

A genuine new member will understand the need for this.

And finally

If you fail to follow this advice then dont come crying to me if it goes t*ts up :)

Edited by mantrid
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In the german GFP forum, it's the other way around. New members got a limitation of 2 posts per day, because we want them to read and think before writing. The 20 posts rule can encourage new members to spam the forum with faqs.

I'm also new to the forum, my problem was, that i haden't found the 30 day rule and was wondering, why this forum got no sale posts ;) I think this rule should be added here http://www.cpukforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=6727

I also think that buying plants from newbies is dangerous. So generally: first cash, then sending of the plant. A rule for swapping is hard... Maybe the person who hasen't 3 month + 50 posts should send first, but what should be the rule swapping, when you got 2 newbies?

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To those who say that buying from new members is at the buyers risk, you are perfectly correct, but unfortunate some feel that it is the forums responsibility to sort it when things go wrong. To be honest the moderators and even more so, Andy are stuck between the devil and the deep sea. We are pretty much powerless to resolve the issues, other than restrict/ban the offending member.

We try to keep the forum a friendly place, but when a transaction goes bad then this can give the forum a bad reputation, even though caution should have been exercised when buying from a new member.

I don't think that we are trying to create a 'nanny state' and we are relatively lenient compared to many forums, we are just trying to make the place a little safer... but as has already been stated, it is impossible to please everyone :roll:

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Hi all,

I have just come out of my probation (I think) and joined, as most novices probably do around the start of the growing season. With a plant or two, a keen interest of getting the advice on growing them and meet others doing so soon leads to the thirst for more plants!

For me I came onto this forum with plenty more than 20 questions so that was over instantly. I can understand that waiting 30 days in the growing season may be a bit of a drag but I don't think the forum should be influenced too much by newbies and if you think this probation offers some protection to the long standing users then keep it. I respected the rule in place and bought my plants online outside the forum and even asked where is best to go on this forum so it's not the end of the world!

The Rep scale I don't think would be so fair as if like me you are more of a question asker than an answerer then you don't really get a 'thumbs up' for your posts and could be waiting years on the forum before the next generation of newbies are able to take your advice!

Just got my first Sarracenia so plenty more questions to follow!

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To those who say that buying from new members is at the buyers risk, you are perfectly correct, but unfortunate some feel that it is the forums responsibility to sort it when things go wrong. To be honest the moderators and even more so, Andy are stuck between the devil and the deep sea. We are pretty much powerless to resolve the issues, other than restrict/ban the offending member.

Errrm, with more trepidation ! :-

I do sympathise, honest I do ! Andy raised the same point earlier this month, in "Changes" post #8

and I replied in #13 "It seems to me daft that Admin should shoulder such a responsibility !" wrt nutters who would try to hold the forum to account in such a bilateral situation and that he should just give them some thumbs down etc.

Isnt it a bit like lots (not all !) of elf&safety where the freedoms of the many are curtailed by the few idiots ?

Eg. Try finding the chemicals to make some fireworks on 5Nov now. I did, thats why I got into science, physics, electronics and ended up designing spacecraft to Comet Halley and others .

Our children dont have that stimulus any more :(

I didnt vote cos there is no option to split buyer probation from seller probation :)

Edited by MalcolmP
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I'm not a fan of the Reputation thing. I found on the forums I either owned or moderated that it eventually turned almost into a popularity contest and it put some people off. Fine if people are popular but I worry about people who are easily intimidated by it and put off.

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I'm not a fan of the Reputation thing. I found on the forums I either owned or moderated that it eventually turned almost into a popularity contest and it put some people off. Fine if people are popular but I worry about people who are easily intimidated by it and put off.

I only give a thumbs up if a post contains useful information.

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Does the forum allow new members to read & respond to posts in the sales forums without being able to start a new thread? That might work.

we cant see the sales forum until we have been a member for 30 days

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I'm not a fan of the Reputation thing. I found on the forums I either owned or moderated that it eventually turned almost into a popularity contest and it put some people off. Fine if people are popular but I worry about people who are easily intimidated by it and put off.

Richard, don't be put off by the reputation thing.I am not a fan of this either.

I don't wish to be the winner of a popularity contest either.

If i read a post and think its worth a reply.i respond. When i respond i say what I THINK and not what people want to hear/read

my responses come from a few years of growing these plants with good and bad experiences.

I have never been swayed by what others say or do,so don't feel intimidated,say what you think,others should do the same.

Just get involved,we all have/had to learn.

This forum just makes it easier to make less mistakes,i wish it was about over 20 years ago when i started.

ada

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