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Sarracenia removed from the lake district.


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Hi folks, Just found this link below.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cumbria-16772704

I know this has been discussed at various times on the forum but looks like the National Trust are taking action. From a conservation view i can understand why, just hope they play it smart and sell the plants on to nurseries or individuals. With a bit of foresight they could make a bit of money to put back in to the conservation. What are your thoughts?. Has anyone been involved in the actual removal work, i bet a lot of us wish we had known about it in advance.

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If they have been in since the 1960's then it will be a hard job to remove them, even a bit of root and as Manders said all the seed, they will come back time after time. So the national trust need CP fanatics with rafts and dingy's to control them :laugh1:

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How about adding some S. prittacina and S. leucophylla in there? :)

Surely one alien species is one too many already. If one wants to see Sarracenia, one can visit North-America or grow them in the garden/greenhouse/window sill.

I have to admit I would enjoy enjoy seeing S. purpurea on a bog anywhere, even if introduced, but I don't think there's any good reason to deliberately introduce alien species in natural habitats.

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Hi all

Surely one alien species is one too many already. If one wants to see Sarracenia, one can visit North-America or grow them in the garden/greenhouse/window sill.

I've got to agree with that, but I dont see them pulling up pansies, wallflowers, tulips etc etc etc, when does an alien species become acceptable?

Cheers

Steve

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In Denmark many of our so called wild trees are introduced versions of original native species but from other parts of the world.

I know a bog near by with a large population of introduced Spp, S x catesbaei and their hybrids. They are huge and wonderful. Each year I collect a few of the best of them and grow them in my garden.

One day they will be removed. I think that is ok, but I enjoy it while I can still see them there. They are impressive...

Martin

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I've got to agree with that, but I dont see them pulling up pansies, wallflowers, tulips etc etc etc, when does an alien species become acceptable?

I don't know. Some species are worse than others (in terms of damage to natural ecosystems), and some have been with us so long they're regarded as natives.

But in this case, to me it seems like it's a easy decision to remove the introduced Sarracenia purpurea. As the article states, they were replacing native plants, including sundews. In addition, if I've understood correctly, there isn't much natural peatland left in England.

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But in this case, to me it seems like it's a easy decision to remove the introduced Sarracenia purpurea. As the article states, they were replacing native plants, including sundews. In addition, if I've understood correctly, there isn't much natural peatland left in England.

Are there any data to support the National Trust assertion that the Sarracenia "were competing with other native insectivorous species such as the Sundew. This isn't just bad for the insect population, but also the birds which eat the insects - it's not good all round."

This statement attributed to the National Trust seems a bit implausible to me. It could, however, just be bad reporting -- or bad science.

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Are there any data to support the National Trust assertion that the Sarracenia "were competing with other native insectivorous species such as the Sundew. This isn't just bad for the insect population, but also the birds which eat the insects - it's not good all round."

This statement attributed to the National Trust seems a bit implausible to me. It could, however, just be bad reporting -- or bad science.

They would only have to empty out a Sarracenia to see if the insects in there are the same ones our native spp of sundew take, in order to determine if they are competing. Im sure they would have performed this simple task. I dont see why Sarracenia wouldnt take the same prey, im not aware of them being particularly selective eaters. Also Sarracenia are much larger and greedier than our native sundews so in my opinion there surely is significant competition.

Edited by mantrid
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This statement attributed to the National Trust seems a bit implausible to me. It could, however, just be bad reporting -- or bad science.

I just assumed that there must be some good evidence for the statement, but you're right, part of it does sound a little implausible. I can understand that S. purpurea might compete for space with sundews, but it sounds less plausible that it has significant impact on insect numbers. Would be curious to know if anybody is aware of published research about these issues.

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I think it's just bad reporting, looking for that catchy soundbite.

To be honest the fact that they are displacing native flora is a good enough reason to remove them

I agree here, removal because they are not native are a valid argument alone.

Spp dont compeate with sundews when it comes to what they catch, and in fact on of the bigger problems around here when cultivating Sarrs outside is that some bird learn how to open the pitchers and get a large meal...

Martin

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I agree here, removal because they are not native are a valid argument alone.

Generally true, but in this I suspect S. purpurea can actually help increase the density of local biodiversity; opposite being an invasive. Sort of like honey bees.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Well when they where competing out Drosera anglica it makes sence. But the common Drosera rotundifolia and minor are not rare fortunately. Well when those Sarracenias where taking over that bog its right they remove them. If they are only growing here and there then its another thing. But there is something to say for removing it as its a nonnative plant. And from another continent. And not endangered there. And back home probably controled by some insect or desase which prevent it from becoming invasive.

In Switzerland they are also found in some bogs. There they leave them as far as I know. Well maybe they do not cause any problems there.

Well what to do with all those exotic conifers like douglas, American oaks, Larix to name a few. They form a large part of the trees in forest here! And invasive as well.

Quercus rubra is in some parts of the country the dominant tree for example. I have not heard any conservation organisation to get rid of them.

Here we had that Aldrovanda case in Nieuwkoop. They tried to remove it without succes I have heard. And a very rare plant in Europe anyway now. Well apparantly that natureconservation organisation has more problems with Aldrovanda then with Quercus rubra.

Well its/was native in Germany. Extinct there but introduced in Switzerland. Fortunately they did not remove them from that country!

Funny world we live in...

Alexander

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  • 3 months later...

OK folks, I have been in touch with the manager of the site in the Lake District. He was amazed that the plants were worth anything at all!

All plants that were removed previously were dumped. However, they will be removing more this summer, mostly small plants as most of the large plants have been removed already. Plants are pulled up, roots and all and placed in large bags which are helicoptered off the bog, and they are happy to offer these to forum members.

Here's the catch though, they won't have time to send off individual plants to people, so the plants need to go in one or two bulk lots, i.e. one or two helicopter bags full! This will most likely be a few hundred plants per bag, and the estimate is that you could probably get one the bags in the back of an average car, and you will need to pick them up in person, and time this to coincide with removal.

They are looking for about £50 or so per bag, money going to a good cause (i.e. conservation of the bog). Any volunteers to pick up a bag or two and distribute to forum members? You would undoubtedly make your money back and more if you make any charge of a few pounds to distribute/sell. I could do it but it is about a three-hour trip each way for me....

Here's your chance to save some Sarracenia, and help with conservation!

If you're interested, please contact me and I'll put you in touch with the site manager.

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