37 replies to this topic

[kahshinlee]

Hey, just wanted to pipe in here. Firstly, a darlingtonia will shoot up a huge pitcher each year in spring before shooting up smaller ones for the rest of the year. They are found mainly in a habitat where there is cold water constantly flowing through their roots. Using black plastic pots and pure peat is a bad idea as it'll cause the roots to overheat. Black pot absorbs heat and the plastic prevents evaporative cooling, the peat will eventually compact resulting in heat retention. On top of that, the compact peat will prevent aeration which will eventually suffocate the roots, but if the plants died off within the first couple of weeks, maybe it's because it wasn't acclimatized to it's new habitat and the change was too sudden? A way to help reduce the amount of stress the plant has to go through, you may want to cut off the older leaves. Anyway,I hope you guys have better luck next time.

God bless,
Aaron

[The body snatcher pod]

Hi Kahsinlee!,
Thank for your reply! But the thing is I had my Darlingtonia planted in pure live Sphagnum moss, and in a big planter. I don´t think it could reach excesive temperatures...

[Cephalotus]

If your plants died suddenly,  they died from a roots fungus infection. I lost two of my three plants once. They were growing perfectly fine, even flowered some time earlier and than one just died. Without any reason. All were grown in the same conditions, same water, and two even in the same pot. The third one, separate one died first. Than one of the two in one pot. But one lived unharmed. I remember that I was powerless to stop them from dying. No fungicide helped. Only once When it just started I cut off the dying plant but I had more than one growing cone and I could do that at all. But the plant eventually died after another infection after quite some time. The third plant I sold, being afraid that it will just die and maybe I am doing something wrong. I learned that what was the cause after talking with one of my friends some years after that when I already had no Darligtonia. This plant is just not easy and it seems it is prone to fungus infections. It might be a good idea to grow it in just pure Sphagnum moss. Because as much as I know, in a living Sphagnum moss, fungus infections occur a load less. But I haven't experimented with that myself yet. It is just read knowledge.

[The body snatcher pod]

Hi Cephalotus,
I think you mean a fungal desease called "fusarium". It infects de uppert parts of the roots system and blocks the water pasages, so the aereal part of the plants starts to wrinkle and dehydrate quickly. And in a few days, the whole plant is dead.  I had some cases this summer, in spite of growing my plants in live Sphagnum.
But is not the case of my Darling. I purchased it in mid summer, planted it in pure Sphagnum, but the plant didn´t do anything. Just hardly surviving. No new growth, and the mature leaves decaying very slowly during the summer. But not the same way as if the plant was infected with fussarium.  I remeber that the plant remained alive and mostly green several month, but refused to grow. And finally died very slowly...

Cephalotus, on 28 February 2013 - 20:15 PM, said:

If your plants died suddenly,  they died from a roots fungus infection. I lost two of my three plants once. They were growing perfectly fine, even flowered some time earlier and than one just died. Without any reason. All were grown in the same conditions, same water, and two even in the same pot. The third one, separate one died first. Than one of the two in one pot. But one lived unharmed. I remember that I was powerless to stop them from dying. No fungicide helped. Only once When it just started I cut off the dying plant but I had more than one growing cone and I could do that at all. But the plant eventually died after another infection after quite some time. The third plant I sold, being afraid that it will just die and maybe I am doing something wrong. I learned that what was the cause after talking with one of my friends some years after that when I already had no Darligtonia. This plant is just not easy and it seems it is prone to fungus infections. It might be a good idea to grow it in just pure Sphagnum moss. Because as much as I know, in a living Sphagnum moss, fungus infections occur a load less. But I haven't experimented with that myself yet. It is just read knowledge.

[Dave Evans]

Umm, I think there is more going on than we think we know here...  The Darlingtonia probably need something to help their roots.  Perhaps a more specific kind of mycorrhizae or something similar.  If the plant losts whatever "it" is, well it just might be doomed...

Has anyone tried using man-made mycorrhizae produces on Darlingtonia?

[FredG]

Dave Evans, on 01 March 2013 - 00:39 AM, said:

If the plant losts whatever "it" is, well it just might be doomed...

I think the 'it' is called life.

Dave Evans, on 01 March 2013 - 00:39 AM, said:

Has anyone tried using man-made mycorrhizae produces on Darlingtonia?

I think you're barking up the wrong tree, I've never had to use products like this.
There again I believe that the black pot theory is rubbish too.

Pure peat is a no no and they're not that keen on peat / perlite mix either, yes they will grow but give the roots a choice of live sphagnum and peat / perlite and they stay in the live sphagnum.

[Cephalotus]

By the occasion, I will ask. Fred, do you think that if it is a good idea to plant a Darlingtonia on a growing Sphagnum moss, that has grown about 15-20 cm above the water level. The pot is in a closed water circulation system. The plant would have a whole 8-y.o. ecosystem where definitely grow some fungus. It will have flowing water, living sphagnum moss and I would like to leave it there for the winter too. :) Ah well... why not show a photo of the pot... here it is:

[FredG]

Chris, this is my Colony No3. It's been in a gravel tray for a couple of seasons so it had to be planted up into a double tray.



The tray will be flooded spring - autumn. No need for moving water or  the plants being raised. The Darlingtonia are quite happy sitting in water.



Winter it is kept a little drier, maybe half full of water and freezes solid.

Edit :- As an afterthought I thought I should show you the results I expect from this method of growing.

The Mother Colony.
Spring



The previous summer



Junior Colony spring



The previous summer

Edited by FredG, 10 March 2013 - 11:35 AM.

[Cephalotus]

Fred, you have fantastic plants with no doubt. You also made me sure that I can leave this species to have some frosts. Question is how harsh? But I already have some conditions and pots. Instead of creating new ones I would prefer to use those which I have to the maximum. My question was if I could grow successfully Darlingtonia in that pot shown above in described conditions or rather not?

The way you are growing yours Darlngtonia is not foreign to me. I also thought of growing this species in mineral, gravely soil maybe with a bit of Sphagnum moss on the surface. It seems I weren't wrong. What type of gravel you use? I mean the type of rock.

(I also started searching for interesting plants accompanying CPs in the wild and in that case it is of course Cypripedium calofornicum. There is also some Platanthera sp., but I don't know which one yet.)

Sorry guys for continuing this off topic. I hope you don't mind.

[FredG]

No rock Chris, that's just Sphagnum moss on 1" (2.5cm) of peat moss ( the peat is for the Sphagnum not the Darlingtonia). I use several species of Sphagnum, it looks better.

Minimum temperatures can be very low, -18C (0F) is not outrageous for these.

[wozzen]

Fred,

Any being divied up at any time??

[FredG]

Probably not until next year now, thinned them out and cut back already.

[billynomates666]

So black pots, kept in hot ish conditions (greenhouse) and shallow depth of growing medium then. Sure does buck a lot of the percieved wisdom, but the results are undeniable not to mention outstanding Fred.

Cheers
Steve

[Cephalotus]

billynomates666, on 12 March 2013 - 13:40 PM, said:

So black pots, kept in hot ish conditions (greenhouse) and shallow depth of growing medium then. Sure does buck a lot of the percieved wisdom, but the results are undeniable not to mention outstanding Fred.

My friend from UK used to grow her Darlingtonia in a greenhouse and according to her, it was more durable than any Sarracenia if it comes for heat. When all of the Sarracenias were withered from heat, the Darlingtonia was looking perfectly normal. So that is not that really surprising. :) Maybe that resistance to heat depends on having a specific clone or locant (used properly?). One might be more heat resistant than the others. Than it would depend on which one you simply get. Maybe it is just general lack (not your Steve) of understanding this plant. That would not be the first time...

I do not have much experience with this species myself, but I think that the biggest treat to this species is a roots fungal disease. It might depend on the temperature, yes, but as the experience of some shows, that might not be the real case. It might depend on the properties of the soil mix one use and than when it is not preferred by the plant, the triggering factor might be the high temperature.

[FredG]

Cephalotus, on 12 March 2013 - 16:14 PM, said:

I do not have much experience with this species myself, but I think that the biggest treat to this species is a roots fungal disease. It might depend on the temperature, yes, but as the experience of some shows, that might not be the real case. It might depend on the properties of the soil mix one use and than when it is not preferred by the plant, the triggering factor might be the high temperature.

Is this just a gut feeling Chris? Can you back this up with some findings?

I think you got it right in the first part of your post.

Cephalotus, on 12 March 2013 - 16:14 PM, said:

Maybe it is just general lack (not your Steve) of understanding this plant. That would not be the first time...

[The body snatcher pod]

Mike King also has his Darligntonias growing in a greenhouse, even in summer, and they are pretty big and doing very well.

[gardenofeden]

Keep them on the floor of the greenhouse in a tray of Sphagnum and you can't really go wrong.

[Cephalotus]

FredG, on 12 March 2013 - 16:53 PM, said:

Is this just a gut feeling Chris? Can you back this up with some findings?

It is a little more like a personal observation of the way I lost a few of mine. The first information I read/heard about this species was that it has to have a cold soil, otherwise it will get a fungal infection and die fast. Because of that I was not allowing myself to have it, since I couldn't provide such condition. Than when I learned that it can grow perfectly in a greenhouse until it has much water I decided to try it. I lost the very first plants in a way which suggested me a fungal infection. Than I tried once more, with three plants. Quite fast one of my plants started wilting like the previous one. I cut all the "infected" parts, changed the soil and cleaned the plants roots. It grew a wile normally, even grew up a little when it got "it" again. This time I couldn't save it, I had nothing more to cut off. Than a second plant also got "the infection" and died. The third plant I gave away thinking I just don't know how to grow this species. I haven't thought that maybe the total change of soil type could help. I was using peat with sand in equal parts than. The peat was of a high quality.

I only thought of trying it once again after learning new things about this species. Living sphagnum moss. My choice was the pot I showed before, because as a mini ecosystem it has grater chance of preventing a morbific fungus from infecting the roots. I also found some photos from its wild habitat showing it growing on wet, black rocks. I also thought about trying it that way.

gardenofeden, on 12 March 2013 - 17:20 PM, said:

Keep them on the floor of the greenhouse in a tray of Sphagnum and you can't really go wrong.

I don't have a greenhouse and won't be able to have one any time soon.