29 replies to this topic

[TheCarnifreak]

Dear Drosophyllum growers,

Drosophyllum lusitanicum is one of my favorite plants. I grew them with great succes several years ago, but during the last years I can't get them to germinate anymore.

I have searched the net and came across several different strategies to germinate them. I putted them in a poll. More choices are possible.

I like to know what is the most used successful strategy to grow Drosophyllum, so I can have best results.

The strategy I used is scarify them with sandpaper and then burry them 0,5 cm in the substrate. I put the pots in a mini-greenhouse on the windowsil. After germination I put the pot in the greenhouse.

Please feel free to explain your chioce! If your correct choice is not there, just let me know!

Please only vote if you had successful germination!

Cheers!

Ries

Edited by TheCarnifreak, 09 February 2012 - 05:31 AM.

[yves]

Hi

Definitely, the best way to get near 100% of germination, even with old seeds
is a treatment with a 4% solution of sulfuric acid.

Just soak the seeds 24h. in a 4% solution of sulfuric acid (H2SO4)
then rinse with water and sow.

Yves

[TheCarnifreak]

yves, on 08 February 2012 - 20:22 PM, said:

Hi

Definitely, the best way to get near 100% of germination, even with old seeds
is a treatment with a 4% solution of sulfuric acid.

Just soak the seeds 24h. in a 4% solution of sulfuric acid (H2SO4)
then rinse with water and sow.

Yves

Interesting Yves! Thanks for your reply. Do you also use sandpaper or just the acid?

Is it just for sale in a DIY store?

I saw I didn't mention sulfuric acid in the poll. I mixed it up with gibberallic acid, which actually is the same as GA3! Its fixed now, you are able to vote.

Cheers,

Ries

Edited by TheCarnifreak, 09 February 2012 - 15:49 PM.

[will T]

Hi,
it's kidding to asnwer to this vote,good idea.:)
But i'd like to advise you about one thing,we should say from where we are,this is very important,cause the weather is different and depends about where you live.
Me i dont need to treat the seeds cause conditions are really good in my region (south east of France),but other ppl will tell you that you must treat them and they will be right too,cause they could come from North of europe...

Best regards

[TheCarnifreak]

@will T: For the last 3 questions you are right about this. Thanks for mentioning! Its possible to see in the poll who all voted, so locations can be checked.

So far, most people seem to scarify the seeds with sandpaper (but its still very close to the other answers).
Most people place the seeds directly in the greenhouse to germinate.
It looks like it doesn't matter if seeds are covered with substrate or not.
Most people grow Drosophyllum in their greenhouse.

[Megs]

I tried to germinate them in a clay pot inside the greenhouse in 2010. Nothng happen and I let the pot stay in the greenhouse over winter. They experienced around minus 15C. The following year I used the pot to something else standing outside exposed to rain and sun. I used the same soil. Mid summer one Drosophyllum germinated and I removed the Delosperma cutting I used the pot for. I grew the plant outside and watered it with rainwater when it became too dry. No standing water. In the fall I had a real nice plant. I took it into the near frost free garage when outside temps came below minus 8C. Its still looking good waiting for spring.

Martin

[yves]

Hi

Only sulfuric acid, this is the acid which is in car battery so it
should be possible to get some at a car mecanic.
You must know the concentration (normally around 30% for car battery)
to make the right dilution.

[TheCarnifreak]

@Megs: Interesting. So a good cold/wet period made the seed germinate. Thanks for sharing. It proves again...never throw seeds away to fast! Patience is holy .

@Yves: Thanks for the info. Maybe this wil also be possible with other acids/corrosive liquids like acetic acid. The hard part is know the right concentration... If its too concentrated the seeds will disappear . Have you tried other acids?

Edited by TheCarnifreak, 10 February 2012 - 06:18 AM.

[yves]

Hi

Never try another acid, because sulfuric acid works very well.

Don't think acetic acid will work, not strong enough certainly  hydrochloric acid
will also work. Many seeds can germinate only after having beeing eaten by birds.
( that's why I try with sulfuric acid, it is not as smelly as hydrochloric acid).

Yves

[BobZ]

I discovered some Drosophyllum seeds in a decrepit paper bag buried in the back of the lunchroom refrigerator at my office. These were from the 1979 ICPS Seed Bank so the seeds had been in that refrigerator for 22 years! In spring 2001, I scratched the seed coat on fine sand paper until I saw white, then soaked the scarified seeds in water for 24 hours. I placed 100 seeds on the surface of moist vermiculite until they germinated. The first seeds began to germinate in 13 days and the remaining continued to germinate for several months. In total about 95% of the seeds germinated, although most damped off before becoming established.

[Vartax]

I tried in vermiculite also, had a very good germination but all died a few weeks after germinating.

I tied outside too with seed on top and same thing.

The only method that worked for me and some friends was putting the seed in the soil and cover them with a fine layer of sand or dirt. No treatment to the seed.

The pot was left outside during the summer and winter with little to no water in the summer and it rains in winter so no problem there. The seed can take more that a year to germinate but with this method we are getting strong seedlings.  No tray with water if it is outside.

The weather is perfect for drosos here because it is Portugal they feel at home.

the soil is another matter that many talk about. We are using 80% sand and normal ground dirt.

If you adapt this method to your country weather please leave us a messages telling if it works.

[TheCarnifreak]

@Yves: I have contacted several car shops to obtain sulfiruc acid. I hope I´ll find some. I have found out that car batteries contain 37% sulfuric acid. Now I have to find out how to make a 4% solution of it. How many parts sulfuric acid (car battery)/water do you mix?

@Bobz: Interesting story! Thanks for sharing. So seeds doesn't necessarily have to be fresh.

@Vartax: Interesting that they only germinate when they are covered in the ideal climate. Such a different stories about Drosophyllum. I'm sure we also need a big load of luck!

[Dave Evans]

Rolled the seeds briefly on some sand paper and sowed.  90 % germination.  Didn't scarify, had nearly the same germination, but it was delayed by several weeks.

[linuxman]

TheCarnifreak, on 14 February 2012 - 20:36 PM, said:

@Yves: I have contacted several car shops to obtain sulfiruc acid. I hope I´ll find some. I have found out that car batteries contain 37% sulfuric acid. Now I have to find out how to make a 4% solution of it. How many parts sulfuric acid (car battery)/water do you mix?

You need to add a volume of water such that the 37% becomes 4%,
i.e. if your original acid volume is v and the amount you need to add is w then,
0.37 x v = 0.04 x (v + w)
Re-arranging gives v x (0.37 - 0.04) = 0.04 x w
Therefore w = v x 0.33 / 0.04, so that w = 8.25 x v

As a check, assume you have 1litre of acid to which you add 8.25litres of water. The total volume is now 9.25litres.
The acid solution started with 37% sulphuric acid (ie 0.37litres). The concentration is now 0.37/9.25 = 0.04 (ie 4%).

Put another way thats 4 parts acid solution to 33 parts water.

Hope this helps.

[yves]

Hi

More simple,  just mix 10 gr of sulfuric acid (37%) with 90 gr of water
You will have a 3.7% solution

Linuxman :

Just be careful you mix volume and weight :-)

Yves

[maxxima]

I keep reading about this damp-off situation killing a great number of seedlings but I have never experienced it myself. I think that situation is a cultivation error.

2-3 months ago 17+ seedlings germinated for me and %100 are still alive today; a few working on the 9th leaf or so. Not a single seedling has died. It's true that a few went black on the tips and keeled over; but a new sprout always formed in the middle. I don't know what caused the situation as I have them in small groups and visibly there's nothing different about them. But the point is they survived.

I'd like to note that seedlings are very resistant to cold. A few germinated outside at 5-10C. I have noticed that when it's below 10C, they won't grow but they won't die either. 3 of my seedlings are outside sitting in 0-5C now; they almost haven't moved in 2 months but they are still alive.

Another observation: There's no such thing as moving shock. I constantly moved them around from day 1 and they didn't notice. I took a few outside to cold weather (0-10C); they didn't grow, stayed the same for a few weeks but as soon as brought them back in; i mean literally the next day, they started growing again.
I am pretty sure they enjoy a little warmth for growing.

Biggest factor for me is light; the more the better. But it's also important to note; lack of light doesn't kill them. I have a few growing without any bulbs and they are very healthy. Not as tall and robust as the others, also slower but their leaves remain alive for a longer time and they don't get burnt on the tips.

Just a few observations from a first-timer, happy growing to all.

[linuxman]

yves, on 15 February 2012 - 20:20 PM, said:

Just be careful you mix volume and weight :-)

Yves

Yes, I made the assumption the mix was by volume. If the proportions are measured by weight then my calculations still apply, ie 4 mass units of acid solution to 33 mass units of water.

But more sensibly I think people would measure liquid by volume. In which case (still assuming the acid is 37% by weight) one would need about 10 parts water to 1 part acid solution by volume (I've used a density of 1.83g/cc for concentrated sulphuric acid to work this out).

Enough of this, it's too much like work  

Cheers,

[gardenofeden]

maxxima, on 15 February 2012 - 22:39 PM, said:

I keep reading about this damp-off situation killing a great number of seedlings but I have never experienced it myself. I think that situation is a cultivation error.

no just the error of living in a damp, humid country where mould runs wild!

[maxxima]

My seedlings have germinated/ are growing on top of the central heating where the humidity reads %10-20, perhaps it's a good idea to decrease humidity then as they don't seem to need it.

[Greg Allan]

I have had success in combating damp-off by growing seedlings in peat pots indoors on a very sunny windowsill. There is insufficient light, even on the sunniest windowsills, it seems, for long-term cultivation, but plants can be grown in peat pots on the windowsill until the leaves are a few cm in height, and then 'Slack-potted' in a greenhouse in full sun.