19 replies to this topic

[pwilson]

Just got back from the AGM and a long and detailed committee meeting. There was a lot to discuss! Here are the basics of what has arisen and decisions taken at the AGM.

1. The big news is that after 19 years Steve Cottell has decided to stand down as Chairman and Paul McKeown,who has served even longer, is also standing down from his various committee roles. Paul and Steve will continue to do their excellent work as show secretaries. The two positions of Show Secretary (Chelsea) and (NEC) have been combined into one post of Show Secretary and because the two shows are so important to the society it was felt that the new position needed to be retained as a committee one. However, as both Steve and Paulboth  feel that they have served on the committee long enough we have made this post a non-executive one, meaning that they will not have voting rights. Paul and Steve will continue to serve as trustees so they still retain a contact with the society. I'd also like to say for the record that the decision that both Paul and Steve take a back seat was actually taken several weeks ago and was in no way influenced by any pressure or comments made on this forum or anywhere else. Of course the committee were aware of this but we felt that the right time to make the announcement was at the AGM and no sooner.

Paul and Steve have both decided to remain as trustees for the society and we welcome their decision. Their combined experience is a valuable asset to the management of the CPS.

2. Voting. We agree that the current system of block voting is unfair and we have put in place rule changes to allow for voting either by electronic or postal ballot, or of course a combination of both. At the moment we have opted for postal voting simply because this is the simplest system to put in place quickly. We also felt that we wanted to get this in place as soon as we possibly can. With this in mind the new committee have been voted in using the old block system but only on an intermim basis.

We will be sending out a ballot form with the next Planta Carnivora which we hope to be sending out some time in May. On this ballot we will list all the current committee and ask for an initial vote. We will not be accepting nominations for posts at this point and I realise that this may disappoint some members but we have a structure that allows for nominations to be called for and put in place for all future elections. We will also be asking members' opinion on this new method of voting and the result of that question will form a basis on whether we adopt elections by ballot.

Assuming we do adopt postal ballots, nominations will be requested in the September newsletter and need to be lodged with me by the end of November. The committee will ask for specific information from the nominee and will use that as a basis for the information on the ballot form. We also felt that we have to reserve the right to reject nominations if we felt that the nominee was unsuitable for the position. For instance, someone who applied for the position of Internet Officer who had no experience of web design. This is to protect the society and is not a means of rejecting nominees that we just do not like so we would give full reasons and there will be a right of appeal.

The ballot forms will be sent with the December publication and there will be a deadline for the return of voting forms.

I am aware that some members will be disapointed that there will be no electronic voting but we felt that it was not feasible to put this in place until we have made significant improvements to the society website. More on that later!

3. The new committee has been elected and consists of the following members. We have also created a new committee post of Vice-Chairman. The posts of Journal and Newsletter have been combined into a new post of Publications Editor and the same with the Assistant Editor post.

Chairman - Tim Bailey
Vice-Chairman - Phil Wilson
Internet Officer - Vacant
Seedbank Organiser - Sheila Little
Membership Secretary - Dennis Balsdon
Treasurer - Flick Foreman
Information Officer - Undecided
Meetings Organiser - Dianne Riddiford
Promotions Officer - Ian Salter
General Secretary - Phil Wilson
Conservation Officer - Vacant
Publications Editor - Tim Bailey
Assistant Publications Editor - Natalie Bailey
Librarian - Under Offer
Show Sectretary - Paul McKeown and Steve Cottell

You will all note that there are two vacant committee positions now! Darren has already announcedhe  is standing down as Internet Officer but he has kindly offered to remain in the post until we have filled it. The Conservation Officer's post is also up for grabs. We are in the process of producing some basic job descriptions for all the committee positions so if anyone feels that they have what it takes to fill either of these important posts please contact me initially, either through the CPS website or send a message through this form.

We also have vacancies for two general committee members. These are executive posts where the members take part in the day to day management of the society but have no specific job on the committee. We feel that general members add a width and scope to the committee and are a useful addtion. Also general members can stand in for other committee members in their abscence though there is no actual requirement to fulfil this role. Again, if you feel that you would like a chance to influence CPS policy please think about applying for one of these posts. Applications initially are to me in the usual ways.

4. Website. We all agree with the comments here and elsewhere that the website needs some considerable changes and realistically this means that we have to have a new website. We feel that a dynamic site is the only way to go with this and we would also like to have an online database for the membership. This will offer some significant advantages including allowing members to access and change their own details, download information and so on. It will also allow us to set up a calendar system where we can set email notifications for things such as renewal dates and meetings and open days. Obviously members without email will be catered for too. The other advantage of an online database will be that we can realistically introduce electronic voting for those who prefer this over postal voting.

We also recognise that this is a lot to expect someone to produce in their spare time and while we still welcome applications for nomination for any interested members, we accept that we may have to employ a professional web designer to carry out this work. At the moment no decisions have been taken other than to investigate all the options. If we did employ a professional designer this does not make the job of Internet Officer redundant since such a large undertaking will need to be project managed and this is best undertaken by someone with the experience and knowledge of the big bad world of the Internet.

5. Chelsea and the NEC. I have already said that the two separate show posts are to be combined into one and that this post is to held jointly by Steve and Paul but on a non-executive basis. It was also announced that despite having been at Chelsea for more years than any of us can remember, for the first time this year we have not been successful in our application. So the CPS will not be at Chelsea. We actually knew this at least a month ago but we have held off making any announcement because there is always a chance that the RHS will reconsider their decision though by now we can safely they almost certainly won't. We are still showing at the Gardener's World Live show at the NEC this year.

6. EEE. All the preparations for the EEE are going according to plan. There was a problem with concession tickets for non-members but this has been resolved to all everyone's satisfaction. We have been set a minimum target of concession tickets to sell based on the costs incurred by Chester Zoo. If we fail to meet this target the CPS will be liable for any shortfall and if we exceed the target we keep the profits, or at least that is the implication. We need to start getting registrations in and to sell concession tickets for non-members. The concession tickets are excellent value - £13.50 which covers both Saturday and Sunday. Even for visitors who just come for one day this is cheaper than the standard entry to the zoo. Members can register for £7.50 and for this get free entry to the zoo on both days. Registrations are very slow at the moment (less than 5% of the membership) so please register as soon as possible if you are intending to come. At the moment we cannot take registrations by PayPal on the EEE website though this will be resolved within the next few days hopefully.

Also members should note that the only way to get free entry is to pre-register. There will be no registrations on the day so if you turn up without having registered you will only be allowed in by paying the full entrance fee.

7. Direct Debits. Flick has been investigating the possibilty of setting up membership payments by Direct Debit. We lose something like 75% of new members each year and we feel that this high turn around may be at least partly explained simply because members forget to renew. Standing orders is not a workable solution because there is no standardised form for Standing Orders, each bank producing their own. This means we are unable to specify a consistent identifier for standing order payments so it appears on our bank statements. Without this it is impossible to identify who has made the payments in every case and this makes Standing Orders unworkable. Direct Debits seemed to offer a solution and we thought we had found a third party company who could set this up on our behalf but the set up costs were prohibitive because of the small number of transactions we would be making.

The third option is to set up Direct Debit payments via the society bank. There is a small set up cost which is acceptable. What is not acceptable is that the bank insists that out Treasurer and Chairman are personally liable for any errors. So for instance if a direct debit payment was put through for £14000 instead of £14 (anyone can miss out a few decimal places!) then our Treasurer and Chairman would be liable for all the costs including any consequential losses of the mistake. Quite obviously this is unacceptable to them and to the rest of the committee.

We have two possible solutions. We can either look for indeminity insurance to cover any damages. Or we can look to change the charitable status to a Limited Charity. This is similar to a limited company where the losses are limited to the assets of the charity and not its officers. Not many people know that at the moment the trustees are financially liable for any losses, say if the society were to be declared insolvent. That's quite some resonsibility!

Phew! I told you we had a lot to get through today. I haven't covered everything that we decided on but I have hopefully covered the main points. If I've forgotten anything I'm sure my fellow committee members will jog my memory so I can come back here and edit!

Phil

[linuxman]

Just a comment on method of membership payment. I'm not a great fan of direct debit but would be quite happy with paypal if given a few reminders before the due date (I'm sure there must be some automatic way of doing this).

I've been with the society less than a year but these changes sound like they're going in the right direction.

Regards,

[pwilson]

linuxman, on 9th April 2011 - 23:31 PM, said:

Just a comment on method of membership payment. I'm not a great fan of direct debit but would be quite happy with paypal if given a few reminders before the due date (I'm sure there must be some automatic way of doing this).

I've been with the society less than a year but these changes sound like they're going in the right direction.

Regards,

Yeah we discussed PayPal and it's something that we're also looking at. Just one of the (probably) many things I forgot to mention. Lol!

Phil

[mobile]

It looks like a lot was discussed and hopefully much of it will go forward. I am delighted to see Tim assume the role of Chairman, for which I think he will do an excellent job. The CPS 'appears' to have been stale for sometime and needs to move on.

pwilson, on 9th April 2011 - 22:41 PM, said:

We lose something like 75% of new members each year and we feel that this high turn around may be at least partly explained simply because members forget to renew.

I suggest that this has a lot to do with the fact that the society does not send out reminders. I have mentioned this before that having the renewal date printed on the address label of any mail correspondence sent out is not sufficient to ensure that people remember what could be several months away. I forgot to renew this year for this reason and was only made aware of it months later when I tried to log into the societies website. I would suggest either email or postal reminders a few weeks before the renewal date, with an option to pay via PayPal or cheque.

For eMembers, the fact that the website is rarely updated could be the reason for not renewing. To be honest, as an eMember myself I find it a little difficult to see what I am getting for my money but a more dynamic website might help with this.

Edited by mobile, 10 April 2011 - 09:39 AM.

[Phil Green]

Phil - Thanks for taking the time at the end of a long day to let us know what is happening. It sounds like things are moving in the right direction.

About memberships reminders. As I understand the CPS rules, reminders have to be sent out
Rule 7
Renewal of membership will not commence until the Membership Secretary has received the prescribed form and
appropriate monies. Members in arrears with their subscriptions and failing to comply with a notice from the
Membership Secretary within 30 days after receiving such a notice, may be considered to have resigned.

If a member is only considered to have resigned after having received a notice (reminder), that would imply that if you haven't been sent that reminder, you are still a member.

[ada]

Thanks for everybodies hard work,and listening to the membership.A great step forward.keep up the good work and thanks for informing us so quickly.
ada

[dennisB]

Hi

We haven't sent out subscription reminders for many years and the vast majority of members have no problem with it.  Member's renewal dates are shown on the journal and other postal address labels and will be on emaill communications shortly - so members will be reminded at least five times a year, probably more.  I guess most people have diaries.

The cost of sending out postal reminders will be approximately £100.

As part of the design process for the new website we will be looking at having an on-line membership system and an improved payment system.  Members with on-line access (I guess around 75%) will then be able to amend their personal details, check their renewal date and perhaps we can also generate reminders automatically.  We would still have to send out postal reminders for the 25% of members who don't have access.

At the moment I am heavily involved in administrative work for the EEE.  Once this is over I will start sending  out reminders to see if it improves member retention.  

regards

Dennis Balsdon
CPS Membership Secretary

[mobile]

dennisB, on 10th April 2011 - 10:33 AM, said:

We haven't sent out subscription reminders for many years and the vast majority of members have no problem with it.  Member's renewal dates are shown on the journal and other postal address labels and will be on emaill communications shortly - so members will be reminded at least five times a year, probably more.  I guess most people have diaries.

Dennis,

Listen to your members and look at the evidence, instead of trying to defend a process that does not work. I do not have a diary and EVERY other service for which I pay a subscription sends me out a reminder, either via email or postal, near the renewal date.

[manders]

mobile, on 10th April 2011 - 10:46 AM, said:

Dennis,

Listen to your members and look at the evidence, instead of trying to defend a process that does not work. I do not have a diary and EVERY other service for which I pay a subscription sends me out a reminder, either via email or postal, near the renewal date.

Without a reminder theres a very high chance i wont renew, I know i haven't in years gone by for that reason.  Being a member of the CPS is not a huge priority for me and i guess for a lot of the other 'floating' members also, i can take it or leave it, i do see a small benefit and like being a member but its just another thing to remember to do on top of a thousand other things and i dont keep these things in my business diary.  A simple email reminder and it would get done as a matter or course.

Certainly the orchid society i belong to sends out postal reminders, if they didn't that membership would also lapse until i got around to renewing, and those meetings i do sometimes attend.

[danthecpman]

I agree reminders are required because i wasnt to clear on when my membership expired i just presumed it had because i stopped getting the newsletter. With a reminder i would have renewed and the CPS would not have 'lost a member'. After the very informative AGM yesterday (which was my first) with the new changes proposed i will be sending my membership forms off on monday  

Edited by danthecpman, 10 April 2011 - 11:44 AM.

[dennisB]

Hi

I wasn't being defensive - just pointing out a few facts of life. I don't need to be defensive.  I spend alot of my time working for the CPS -  however I do have other things in my life.    I  spend at least some of each day on membership matters including renewals.  I do what is widely regarded as a good job and I enjoy doing it.

I have already said in my last post that I will try to find the time to send out reminders when the EEE is over.  I have responded to the observations made here.  

Unlike larger charities, we don't have the funds to employ anyone to do our administration.  Those of us who do the "boring" stuff are all volunteers.  Please give us a bit of slack before we all decide its too much hassle.

Dennis

[manders]

dennisB, on 10th April 2011 - 13:08 PM, said:

Please give us a bit of slack before we all decide its too much hassle.

Dennis

Not having a go at all at you dennis.  As i've said in other posts, I'm amazed anyobody finds time to do any of this stuff at all, I know i wouldn't, at least not regularly.

On the other hand I would have thought maintaining membership numbers would be high on a priority list?  There must be some easy way of maintaining a list of email addresses from people who have allready paid by paypal and at least reminding those people to rejoin?

[pwilson]

More interesting points!

Automatic email reminders should be fairly easy to set uo in Access aren't they Dennis? And even though we have something in the region of 160 postal members I'd guess that the majority of these can still be contacted by email. We could also use something like Google Calendar or something similar. Whatever, getting these reminders automated has to be the way to go, particularly when we all lead such busy lives!

One thing to bear with other societes such as the Orchid society is that they presumably have a single renewal date so it's a once a year job for someone to go through the membership list and send out reminders. We have rolling memberships where you have a 12 month membership whenever you join, which would mean that Dennis would have to check for late renewals every few weeks. I'm sure Dennis has had more interesting jobs than this one!

The key to all this is almost certainly to get the website revamped which will give all members except those members with no email contact an automated reminder.

There are a couple of thngs I forgot to mention on my post last night.

First, we are planning to rename the post of Information Officer to Enquiries Officer and this person will handle most of the enquiries directed to the CPS making sure that they are sent to the relevant person. The exception will be Dennis who gets a lot of membership enquiries and Dennis will continue to have these sent directly to him. My fellow committee members might not remember discussing this and for good reason since I completely forgot to add it to the agenda. Though in my defense we had a lot to discuss already!

The other thing concerns rule changes. At the moment rule changes have to be voted in at the AGM with a show of hands and a 2/3rds majority. We feel that rule changes should be subject to same democratic process as voting for the committee and so we intend to change the rules so that rules are voted on by ballot at the same time as the committee elections. However, the rules state that the particular rule that states how rules will be changed has to be approved by the charities commission so regretably we won't be able to bring change the system of changing the rules for another year. We'll get there eventually though.  

Phil

[pwilson]

mobile, on 10th April 2011 - 09:07 AM, said:

For eMembers, the fact that the website is rarely updated could be the reason for not renewing. To be honest, as an eMember myself I find it a little difficult to see what I am getting for my money but a more dynamic website might help with this.

Hi Mobile,

I meant to answer this point yesterday but with all the sunny weather I had other things to do.  Lol!

I want to clear up that being an e-member doesn't actually give you anything extra on the website so this is not a fault with the site. The purpose of having e-members is that we deliver certain publications to you in PDF format rather than as printed materials sent to you in the post. I introduced this as a concept several years ago and the advantages are several. For the CPS we have to print (and more importantly) pack far fewer newsletters because e-members get these online via the website. This benefits the environment of course because there is less paper to waste (though we don't know how many members still print out their newsletters). But the main benefit to members is that you get your newsletter faster without any postal delays and of course we can also pass on the savings of printing and postage to you as a member. This is why e-members pay £10 a year for their membership whereas postal members pay an extra £3.00.

In fact with the introduction of the Planta Carnivora twice a year there are now only two newsletters each year so as an e-member you get even more for your money! Two quality printed journals a year instead on just the one for a tenner! Can't be bad really...    

As ever I'm open to suggestions of course and if you can think of anything on the website that you'd like to see - not neccessarily specific to just e-members, then by all means let us know.

Phil

[mobile]

pwilson, on 11th April 2011 - 12:03 PM, said:

Hi Mobile,

I meant to answer this point yesterday but with all the sunny weather I had other things to do.  Lol!

I want to clear up that being an e-member doesn't actually give you anything extra on the website so this is not a fault with the site. The purpose of having e-members is that we deliver certain publications to you in PDF format rather than as printed materials sent to you in the post. I introduced this as a concept several years ago and the advantages are several. For the CPS we have to print (and more importantly) pack far fewer newsletters because e-members get these online via the website. This benefits the environment of course because there is less paper to waste (though we don't know how many members still print out their newsletters). But the main benefit to members is that you get your newsletter faster without any postal delays and of course we can also pass on the savings of printing and postage to you as a member. This is why e-members pay £10 a year for their membership whereas postal members pay an extra £3.00.

In fact with the introduction of the Planta Carnivora twice a year there are now only two newsletters each year so as an e-member you get even more for your money! Two quality printed journals a year instead on just the one for a tenner! Can't be bad really...    

As ever I'm open to suggestions of course and if you can think of anything on the website that you'd like to see - not neccessarily specific to just e-members, then by all means let us know.

Phil

Hi Phil,

The latest publication available for me to download on the website is 'The CPS News No.3, Dec 2009', with 'The CPS News No.4, Mar 2010' showing but with no hyperlink so can't be opened. I do find it refreshing that you and the CPS in general are open to suggestions though, as some previous email correspondence have not appeared to be so responsive. The dawning of a new age of the CPS maybe

[pwilson]

mobile, on 11th April 2011 - 12:18 PM, said:

Hi Phil,

The latest publication available for me to download on the website is 'The CPS News No.3, Dec 2009', with 'The CPS News No.4, Mar 2010' showing but with no hyperlink so can't be opened. I do find it refreshing that you and the CPS in general are open to suggestions though, as some previous email correspondence have not appeared to be so responsive. The dawning of a new age of the CPS maybe

I'll check it out. I know that since the introduction of the Planta Carnivora we only produce two newsletters a year now but there should be some from 2010 at least. As I've said before, the site interface isn't easy to navigate. I tried to update the committee list this morning and failed to even find the page!

Thanks for the heads up. We will all try to maintain a presence here though it isn't always possible due to workloads and general forgetfulness. If you ever need to contact any committee member try sending me a PM. There is now a single contact for the CPS (apart from membership enquiries which go straight to Dennis) which should also enable us to be more responsive. All we need to do is work out how to update the old website to reflect this. We are looking at a completely new site but that isn't going to happen over night.

Phil

[mobile]

Phil, do you have FTP access to the site? It might be easier to edit the page offline and upload it.
Scratch that, as they are hyperlinked to a contact form so updating manually would be too much hassle.

Edited by mobile, 12 April 2011 - 15:53 PM.

[pwilson]

mobile, on 12th April 2011 - 13:42 PM, said:

Phil, do you have FTP access to the site? It might be easier to edit the page offline and upload it.
Scratch that, as they are hyperlinked to a contact form so updating manually would be too much hassle.

Unfortunately it doesn't work that way though it would be nice if it did. One of the main issues with the current interface is that we don't want to try updating the site by the back door, if any back door exists, because there is a danger of messing up the entire site.

I've fixed the link so you can get the March 10 newsletter anyway. I still have to get the other two seedlists up from last year but haven't had the time to do it today as I'm going to have to do a slight redesign on the downloads page. I'm going to put some information up somewhere about the new system with Planta Carnivora too. We now produce two editions of Planta Carnivora each year, which effectively combine the articles that would have appeared in the newsletter with those that would have been in the journal. It makes sense of course to have everything all together. Then in the other two quarters of each year we publish the seedlist plus any society announcements. I was getting confused and I'm supposed to know!

Phil

[mobile]

pwilson, on 13th April 2011 - 16:13 PM, said:

I've fixed the link so you can get the March 10 newsletter anyway.

Hi Phil,

I think that you might have the link wrong, as currently it's pointing to the seed bank 'cpsnewsmarch2010seedbankpages.pdf', rather than the newsletter.

[pwilson]

mobile, on 13 April 2011 - 17:18 PM, said:

Hi Phil,

I think that you might have the link wrong, as currently it's pointing to the seed bank 'cpsnewsmarch2010seedbankpages.pdf', rather than the newsletter.

Sorry - haven't been here for a few days.

Tim is away at the moment and is the authority on this but I believe that March last year was when the new regime was introduced where you get the combined newsletter and journal twice a year (June and January) and then we produce an interim seedlist for the other two quarters, March and September). The confusion (and I admit to being a little confused myself) is that in some instances this seedlist has continued to be called a newsletter, presumably as a hangover from the old system. Obviously it isn't and what will happen now is that there will be just a single seedlist up which is whatever is the current one. There is absolutely no point in having out of date seedlists is there?

The seedlist can also contain last minute announcements and updates to the last Planta Carnivora so maybe it should be called something else other than the seedlist. But obviously not Newsletter...

Phil