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Bog garden is the soil safe


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#1 mattynatureboy44

 
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Posted 27 August 2010 - 14:37 PM

Hi,

Was just after some advice on my bog garden, I have noticed that some leaves and twigs and even a little bit of normal soil sometimes get in it and have mixed in the bog and these are the bits I have seen in there so there must be some bits I have missed that have sunk or mixed into the bog.

My questions are will this affect the soil its a very deep bog made up of mainly peat moss and some sand but over time will nutrients build up in the bog and affect my plants and will the garden soil that has slid in albeit being a very small amount affect this.

As my bog is very wet I am I right in thinking any nutrients in the garden soil that gets in it will deminish in the bog environment.

Also something keeps digging up my venus flytraps and areas of the bog any ideas what this is?.

Cheers

Matt

Edited by mattybadboy44, 27 August 2010 - 17:42 PM.


#2 mantrid

 
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Posted 27 August 2010 - 22:20 PM

Hi,

Was just after some advice on my bog garden, I have noticed that some leaves and twigs and even a little bit of normal soil sometimes get in it and have mixed in the bog and these are the bits I have seen in there so there must be some bits I have missed that have sunk or mixed into the bog.

My questions are will this affect the soil its a very deep bog made up of mainly peat moss and some sand but over time will nutrients build up in the bog and affect my plants and will the garden soil that has slid in albeit being a very small amount affect this.

As my bog is very wet I am I right in thinking any nutrients in the garden soil that gets in it will deminish in the bog environment.

Also something keeps digging up my venus flytraps and areas of the bog any ideas what this is?.

Cheers

Matt


My understanding is there is no shortage of potential nutrients in a bog. Its practically all plant material with their proteins and minerals. However the acid in the bog acts as a preservative stopping the microbes breaking it down and releasing the nitrogen in the proteins as ammonia. nitrites and nitrates that is used by most plants but not tolerated well by many CPs. So long as your bog is acid I cant see there being a problem. organic matter would be constantly accumulating in natural bogs and the CPs there are not affected.

#3 mattynatureboy44

 
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Posted 28 August 2010 - 00:41 AM

My understanding is there is no shortage of potential nutrients in a bog. Its practically all plant material with their proteins and minerals. However the acid in the bog acts as a preservative stopping the microbes breaking it down and releasing the nitrogen in the proteins as ammonia. nitrites and nitrates that is used by most plants but not tolerated well by many CPs. So long as your bog is acid I cant see there being a problem. organic matter would be constantly accumulating in natural bogs and the CPs there are not affected.


Thanks for the quick reply that answers my question ... so i shouldnt have to worry about this then or spend countless hours picking out the little leaves and pieces of soil and debry that get into the bog.

Will the bog loose its acidity over time?

#4 James O'Neill

 
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Posted 28 August 2010 - 11:20 AM

Not as long as you keep the Sphagnum Moss in it.

#5 Amar

 
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Posted 28 August 2010 - 11:41 AM

My understanding is there is no shortage of potential nutrients in a bog. Its practically all plant material with their proteins and minerals. However the acid in the bog acts as a preservative stopping the microbes breaking it down and releasing the nitrogen in the proteins as ammonia. nitrites and nitrates that is used by most plants but not tolerated well by many CPs. So long as your bog is acid I cant see there being a problem. organic matter would be constantly accumulating in natural bogs and the CPs there are not affected.


Thanks for that, I never did quite understand why peat is *nutrient-poor* soil. So it's actually not, but it's the acidity preventing the nutrients being in a form, that they could affect the plants.
Would that also mean, hypothetically speaking, that if one could lower the pH of any given soil to CP-friendly levels, it could be used as substrate?

#6 mantrid

 
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Posted 28 August 2010 - 22:42 PM

Thanks for that, I never did quite understand why peat is *nutrient-poor* soil. So it's actually not, but it's the acidity preventing the nutrients being in a form, that they could affect the plants.
Would that also mean, hypothetically speaking, that if one could lower the pH of any given soil to CP-friendly levels, it could be used as substrate?



Depends on the acids you use to acidify it. I tried an experiment with sawdust acidified with various organic acids such as citric and tataric acid but the plants promptly died with the tartaric acid. What I really wanted to use was Fulvic and Humic Acid, but the idea was to create a cheap peat substitute and the Fulvic and Humic Acids are expensive defeating the object of the exercise. I didnt get around to using the citric acid or other types of base to take the place of the sawdust, Ive been distracted with other things. Maybe next summer.

#7 dchasselblad74

 
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Posted 29 August 2010 - 05:40 AM

Keep in mind that in the wild, natural bogs experience a cycle of semi floods in the rainy season, that washes away nutrients such as nitrogen compounds. Now in a man made bog, this is almost very difficult to mimic, so instead, you have to almost always replace the entire substrate every few years or so, to get rid of those pesky minerals. But a few leaves and twigs here and there aint gonna hurt nothin. In fact if you research photos of natural bogs in Florida, North Carolina and so forth, youll see that there are plenty of other plants such as grasses, shrubs, palms, and other bushes. The key to the acidic soil are the trees that grow there predominantly(Pine Trees). These trees shed tons and tons of pine needles. And mosses such as sphagnum flourish in this pine forest due to the acidity brought forth by the decomposition of pine needles. You want to boost your bogs acidity naturally, put lots of chopped up pine needles and your Sarracenias and other CPs will thank you for it.....try it, thats what I put in my backyard bogs.....

DexFC :wink:

#8 mattynatureboy44

 
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Posted 29 August 2010 - 11:38 AM

Keep in mind that in the wild, natural bogs experience a cycle of semi floods in the rainy season, that washes away nutrients such as nitrogen compounds. Now in a man made bog, this is almost very difficult to mimic, so instead, you have to almost always replace the entire substrate every few years or so, to get rid of those pesky minerals. But a few leaves and twigs here and there aint gonna hurt nothin. In fact if you research photos of natural bogs in Florida, North Carolina and so forth, youll see that there are plenty of other plants such as grasses, shrubs, palms, and other bushes. The key to the acidic soil are the trees that grow there predominantly(Pine Trees). These trees shed tons and tons of pine needles. And mosses such as sphagnum flourish in this pine forest due to the acidity brought forth by the decomposition of pine needles. You want to boost your bogs acidity naturally, put lots of chopped up pine needles and your Sarracenias and other CPs will thank you for it.....try it, thats what I put in my backyard bogs.....

DexFC :thumbsup:


Thanks for that information, that sounds like a great way to help your bog naturally when you say pine needles would pine needles from a christmas tree be ok I have a huge one in my garden been there 30 years and it drops lots of needles.

#9 dchasselblad74

 
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Posted 29 August 2010 - 21:11 PM

Yes sir...thatll do..any pine variety will do....as long as its not the plastic christmas tree...he he he

DexFC

Edited by dchasselblad74, 29 August 2010 - 21:14 PM.


#10 Alexander Nijman

 
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Posted 03 September 2010 - 02:38 AM

In the wild a lot of carnivorous plants also grow on moist to wet sandy soils wich have been leached out by centuries of rain.

Alexander